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12-13-2012, 04:23 PM   #191
Denny
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by broadbill I don't anybody out-rightly rejects the conclusions, it think they are questioning the jump in logic between what how the experiments were done in the thesis and what homebrewers are doing now. Hull's thesis work was adding OO to stored yeast, but homebrewers have extrapolated this work to suggest that adding OO to wort directly is going to have some effect. As Denny has pointed out (and his friend's tasting experiment shows), adding OO in this fashion does not have any significant effect.
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12-13-2012, 08:54 PM   #192
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Wasn’t Vance’s experiment done with the toothpick method? A microscopic amount of oil in 5 gallons?

From “someone at New Belgium.” in the original post

Quote:
 For the volume of wort we normally ferment, we would pitch about 4500L of yeast, and to that we would add around 300mL of olive oil. To translate that into a 5 gallon size, you would need to measure about 0.0000833mL of olive oil.
OK they were using 1mg/25 billion cells. Mr Malty says 5 gallons of 1.057 wort should be pitched with 198 billion cells.So that’s 7.92 mg. Oleic acid is .895 g/mL so that’s .0088 mL, about a fifth of a drop.

Somewhere in the thread, somebody calculated .083 mL. I checked it and it seemed right at the time. I don’t remember how it was figured.

Looking at it another way, 2100hL is about 11000 five gal batches. 300ml/11000 is .027 mL, half a drop. Still in the ballpark. About a hundred times closer than “someone at New Belgium.”

From the original thesis:
Quote:
 as the amount of olive oil was increased with each trial, the fermentation performance improved. It is possible that the rate of fermentation and the ratio of esters to higher alcohols could be improved if the amount of olive oil addition were increased beyond the rate of 1 mg / 25 billion cells. For this brand, the increase in total esters was perceived as preferable by the flavor panel.
So, more is better, at least up to a point. And, if you read the thesis you’ll find that they added it to the yeast five hours before the pitch.
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12-28-2012, 07:35 PM   #193
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Tried the olive oil on an English Mild I just brewed. I won't get much evidence out of this since I didn't split the batches. Once I've completed my 10 gallon brew setup, I will split up that first batch into two.

Either way, I'll post the results of the brew as soon as it's finished.

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01-15-2013, 05:06 AM   #194
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As I mentioned, my experiment isn't very scientific. However, I wanted to report that my English Mild turned out fantastic. Used only Olive Oil with very minimal amount of splashing / aeration while transferring from kettle to fermenter.

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"There is no strong beer, only weak men"
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Primary: Viking Metal, Berliner Weisse
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Notable Empties: Oaked Black IIPA, BBK I, Red IIPA, Burning Bush, Apophis "The Destroyer", Vanilla Porter
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01-15-2013, 05:09 AM   #195
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Haputanlas As I mentioned, my experiment isn't very scientific. However, I wanted to report that my English Mild turned out fantastic. Used only Olive Oil with very minimal amount of splashing / aeration while transferring from kettle to fermenter.
Something like a mild doesn't need much oxygenation if you use a healthy starter. Thanks for the info and let us know if you do other beers like this.
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01-15-2013, 05:17 AM   #196
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Hermit Something like a mild doesn't need much oxygenation if you use a healthy starter. Thanks for the info and let us know if you do other beers like this.
Agreed. Part of the point for me using this method on the mild was the fact that it should be low risk.
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"There is no strong beer, only weak men"
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Primary: Viking Metal, Berliner Weisse
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Notable Empties: Oaked Black IIPA, BBK I, Red IIPA, Burning Bush, Apophis "The Destroyer", Vanilla Porter
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01-15-2013, 07:01 AM   #197
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Just re-brewed an Amber that I've done a few times, same process, hit my target OG. Never able to get it down the last few points though. Used a tiny drop into my already complete starter (was fresh yeast, made a starter, sat for 5 days before I cooled it to knock down the yeast), about 5 hours before it was needed for pitching. If I can finally get this down an extra couple of points for the FG, I'll have a bit more evidence whether or not this was impactful. and can compare the taste to the last batch. Should know something in ~6 weeks.

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01-15-2013, 04:50 PM   #198
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by luke2080 Just re-brewed an Amber that I've done a few times, same process, hit my target OG. Never able to get it down the last few points though. Used a tiny drop into my already complete starter (was fresh yeast, made a starter, sat for 5 days before I cooled it to knock down the yeast), about 5 hours before it was needed for pitching. If I can finally get this down an extra couple of points for the FG, I'll have a bit more evidence whether or not this was impactful. and can compare the taste to the last batch. Should know something in ~6 weeks.
But without splitting the batch for a control, how will you know that anything is due to the OO?
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01-20-2013, 04:51 PM   #199
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Denny But without splitting the batch for a control, how will you know that anything is due to the OO?
I was running off the fact that I've brewed this enough without other variables changing. Easier to make the one starter than 2.

But I've had to add a heating element to the ferm chamber thanks to winter, and am using it for a slightly different fermentation temp schedule, so I've messed up my poor pretend control of previous batches.

Sill, I'll post the results as a comparison when I have it. If the OO shows decent results, maybe I'll take the next step and do an actual controlled experiment or two.
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01-20-2013, 10:30 PM   #200
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It seems to me that people keep proving over and over that OO doesn't hurt anything. I'm on board with that. What I'm looking for is evidence that it actually helps.

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