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Old 11-01-2006, 12:51 PM   #1
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Default Sufficient Yeast Cells In Suspension After Lagering?

This is my first time lagering---just got a chest freezer and temp controlled. I was wondering, since lagering causes yeast to fall out of suspension faster, will there be enough yeast cells left in suspension after a couple months of lagering, in order to sufficiently carbonate the beer in bottles?

Along those lines, I've been noticing that beers which get longer conditioning time in secondary take longer to carbonate in bottle. I'm guessing that this is due to less yeast in suspension. As such, with these beers, I've taken to deliberately disturbing the yeast cake when racking to the bottling bucket. Bad idea?

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Old 11-01-2006, 02:04 PM   #2
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Rousing the yeast negates the purpose of using a clearing tank. You would probably be better off adding a little fresh yeast to the bottling bucket. That way you don't have hop particles, etc in the bottles. Also, the yeast in the clearing tank are the least floccuant yeast in the batch, which means a long clearing time in the bottle. Use a high flocculation yeast like Cooper's or Munton's Gold or safale S-04. You only need a pinch (AKA 1 gram).

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Old 11-01-2006, 02:28 PM   #3
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Is there any risk, if you add a different strain of yeast to the bottling bucket, of potentially over-carbing the beer? Is there a danger that the new yeast will do a better job of consuming sugars that the original buggers left behind? Some yeasts will do a better job than others at consuming the fermentable sugars, right? Could that potentially result in what would effectively be a secondary fermentation in the bottle (the previously unconsumed sugars plus the priming solution).

Or, am I just completely bat-sh!t insane?

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Old 11-01-2006, 02:53 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by david_42
Rousing the yeast negates the purpose of using a clearing tank. You would probably be better off adding a little fresh yeast to the bottling bucket. That way you don't have hop particles, etc in the bottles. Also, the yeast in the clearing tank are the least floccuant yeast in the batch, which means a long clearing time in the bottle. Use a high flocculation yeast like Cooper's or Munton's Gold or safale S-04. You only need a pinch (AKA 1 gram).
david, have you actually ever done that? I'd be scared of getting bottle bombs by adding highly active yeast to a finished brew. A package of Nottingham is 11.5 grams, so even a gram of dry yeast is a helluva lot of yeast.

How do those little carbonation pills that you add one per bottle work? Do they also require active yeast in suspension to do their thing?
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Old 11-01-2006, 02:57 PM   #5
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Those drops are just pre-measured sugar. They kinda remind me of these candies that my grandparents always used to have around.

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Old 11-01-2006, 02:59 PM   #6
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Ok, then you still have to have yeast. Introducing a controlled amount of yeast would be key, I suppose.

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Old 11-01-2006, 03:08 PM   #7
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From all that I've read, you still have enough yeast in suspension, even after a long period of cold conditioning, to bottle-carb. I imagine it'll take a bit longer, though.

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Old 11-01-2006, 03:27 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beer4breakfast
Ok, then you still have to have yeast. Introducing a controlled amount of yeast would be key, I suppose.
It's not the amount of yeast that's added, it's the amount of fermentables. The yeast will grow to match the amount of fermentables present if it is underpitched, and if overpitched it will just rapidly ferment whatever is there but it can't produce extra food.

When I am bottle priming and am planning to age a beer for more than 6-8 weeks in the secondary I like to harvest some yeast from the primary and save it in the fridge. I then reintroduce it to the secondary ~3 days before bottling which has always resulted in a good, clean bottle fermentation.
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Old 11-01-2006, 03:39 PM   #9
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BvBG, do you harvest the yeast at high kreausen?

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Old 11-01-2006, 04:14 PM   #10
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Well, in the instances where i disturbed the trub, I wasn't clarifying as much as I was conditioning. They were both stouts. And since both of them were actually in tertiary, the amount of trub was miniscule...shouldn't affect clarity at all.

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.planned:
•Scottish 80/- •Sweet Stout •Roggenbier
.primary | bright:
98: Moss Hollow Soured '09 72: Oude Kriek 99: B-Weisse 102: Brett'd BDSA 104: Feat of Strength Helles Bock 105: Merkin Brown
.on tap | kegged:
XX: Moss Hollow Springs Sparkling Water 95: Gott Mit Uns German Pils 91b: Brown Willie's Oaked Abbey Ale 103: Merkin Stout
98: Yorkshire Special 100: Maple Porter 89: Cidre Saison 101: Steffiweizen '09 (#3)
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