Happy HolidaySs Giveaway - Winners Re-Re-Re-Re-Drawn - 24 hours to Claim!

Get your HBT Growlers, Shirts and Membership before the Rush!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Techniques > Saison 3724 Yeast Starter
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-16-2009, 09:44 PM   #1
Jsta Porter
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 94
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default Saison 3724 Yeast Starter

Hello,

Thanks for the assistance.

I am making a Saison with an OG of 1.072 and Wyeast 3724. Using Mr Malty I need 3.63 liters of starter. I checked the gravity after 3 days from initial development of the starter, which had about 2 pints of wort. It is at 1.030. With most yeasts it is down to 1.010 within a day or so. I do oxygenate the wort prior to addition and use yeast nutrients. I have heard that 3724 is a slow fermenter.

Questions:
1. Do I need to wait for the starter to reach lower OG's before additional wort addition?
2. I believe that 3724 likes higher temps for fermentation. Current temps are about 76 degrees. Do I need to raise the starter temps to assist in the yeast development?

Many thanks!!

__________________
Jsta Porter is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-16-2009, 09:50 PM   #2
sirsloop
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: South River, NJ
Posts: 2,592
Liked 17 Times on 15 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

What exact nutrients did you add? Some of them kill the yeast if added in high doses (like in a starter).

__________________
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~___//_ ____________________________~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~_/ [][]| | /```\/```\/```\/```\/```\ |~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~_/_______| |____NOW TRIPLE HOPPED______|~~~~~~~~~~
~~~___/[_]| 00 /| | \,,,/\,,,/\,,,/\,,,/\,,,/ |~~~~~~~~~~
~~|___|___|___/_| |___________________________|~~~~~~~~~~
~~|=(*)[________]==(*)(*)=| \________/=(*)(*)=|~~~~~~~~~~
sirsloop is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-17-2009, 12:29 AM   #3
Jsta Porter
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 94
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Sirsloop,

I added a nutrient that came from my LHBS. It is tagged "yeast nutrient with hulls", so I do not know the exact composition. I have used it in most all previous starters and many a brews. I did not know that nutrient could kill yeast. I added it proportionally to the recommended dosage of 1/2 tsp per gallon.

Side questions- How does the nutrient kill yeast?

Many Thanks!!

__________________
Jsta Porter is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-17-2009, 01:41 AM   #4
sirsloop
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: South River, NJ
Posts: 2,592
Liked 17 Times on 15 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Lallemand Wine - Nutrients

" IMPORTANT: NEVER USE NUTRIENTS CONTAINING AMMONIA SALTS SUCH AS DAP DURING YEAST REHYDRATION - THEY ARE TOXIC TO THE YEAST AT HIGH LEVELS!"
__________________
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~___//_ ____________________________~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~_/ [][]| | /```\/```\/```\/```\/```\ |~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~_/_______| |____NOW TRIPLE HOPPED______|~~~~~~~~~~
~~~___/[_]| 00 /| | \,,,/\,,,/\,,,/\,,,/\,,,/ |~~~~~~~~~~
~~|___|___|___/_| |___________________________|~~~~~~~~~~
~~|=(*)[________]==(*)(*)=| \________/=(*)(*)=|~~~~~~~~~~
sirsloop is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-17-2009, 01:50 AM   #5
PseudoChef
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
PseudoChef's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: West Chicago 'Burbs, IL
Posts: 3,424
Liked 102 Times on 75 Posts
Likes Given: 39

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirsloop View Post
Lallemand Wine - Nutrients

" IMPORTANT: NEVER USE NUTRIENTS CONTAINING AMMONIA SALTS SUCH AS DAP DURING YEAST REHYDRATION - THEY ARE TOXIC TO THE YEAST AT HIGH LEVELS!"
That is for dried yeasts, which most (if not all) wine yeasts are. Won't affect a liquid strain that the OP is using.

Back on topic, the Saison yeast is notoriously slow fermenting. Yes, it does like higher temperatures, but for the starter is should not matter that much. You are not looking for fermentation, you are looking for cell reproduction (but it may still take a while). I wouldn't add any additional wort right now.
__________________

PseudoChef is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-17-2009, 03:32 PM   #6
Jsta Porter
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 94
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

OK,

Makes sense thanks.

When do the yeast cells actually reproduce, and how will I know if they are ready for more food?

__________________
Jsta Porter is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-17-2009, 05:03 PM   #7
Piotr
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Poland, EU
Posts: 463
Liked 4 Times on 3 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jsta Porter View Post
1. Do I need to wait for the starter to reach lower OG's before additional wort addition?
2. I believe that 3724 likes higher temps for fermentation. Current temps are about 76 degrees. Do I need to raise the starter temps to assist in the yeast development?
1. Best moment to step up starter is high krausen phase (it takes usualy 8-16h to get there), don't wait to the very end of fermentation

2. 76F is OK, higher is OK, lower is OK. Temp of a starer is not a big issue, generally room temperatures are mostly used.
__________________
Piotr is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-17-2009, 05:34 PM   #8
Edcculus
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 4,567
Liked 41 Times on 38 Posts

Default

Don't even worry about checking the gravity of a starter. You aren't making beer, you are making healthy yeast. Jamil's calculator assumes that if you pitch x amount of yeast (determined by how old the pack is and company), it will produce x amount of cells in x amount of starter wort (around the 1.040 SG range) that will be needed to properly ferment a beer of whatever volume and OG you specify.

__________________
Edcculus is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wyeast 3724 Belgian Saison - they were right! SavageSteve Fermentation & Yeast 298 10-13-2014 02:24 PM
Saison with Wyeast 3724 - 94 degrees ideal? TristanL Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 21 11-28-2013 01:39 PM
Question: Wyeast 3724 - Belgian Saison behavior EinGutesBier Recipes/Ingredients 30 05-31-2013 02:10 PM
Saison and Wyeast 3724 AnOldUR Recipes/Ingredients 11 07-01-2010 11:10 AM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS