New Giveaway - Wort Monster Conical Fermeneter!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Techniques > Mash times?




Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-07-2009, 07:19 PM   #1
hopsoda
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Iowa
Posts: 289
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default Mash times?

I don't quite understand mash times ,
I have been making simple AG Ales
Mashing at 152F +/- for 1 hour then mash out at 168-170F +/- Fly sparge

to my understanding at different temps, different sugars break down (because of enzymes) into the wort that the yeast gets to eat ... Result beer!

why do some recipes call for shorter/longer mash times , or step mash times?

does this change the flavor , and the efficiency ,

don't i want all the sugar's possible so why shorter / lower temp mashes ...

and what flavor is the result from / shorter longer .. or steping

I'm confused can someone explain this to me , or a link on some reading.



__________________
hopsoda is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-07-2009, 08:01 PM   #2
Denny
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Eugene OR
Posts: 4,113
Liked 384 Times on 292 Posts
Likes Given: 388

Default

In general, the longer the mash, the more time the enzymes have to break down dextrines and the more fermentable the wort will be. It doesn't have as much impacgt as mash temp, but it does have an impact.



__________________

Life begins at 60....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

http://www.experimentalbrew.com - the website for the book "Experimental Homebrewing"...coming Nov. 2014

Denny is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-07-2009, 08:21 PM   #3
hopsoda
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Iowa
Posts: 289
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Thanks , my question then is why do some people only mash for 30 - 45 min
when others mash for an hour , do different grains need to sit longer than others to get the conversion?

or are they trying to get sweeter or dryer beers from non-fermentables
depending on mash time? , if so whats a ... uhhh a guide line for mash times for different styles?

Example: a recipy for a wheat beer all grain called for 30 min at 150F
and a mash out at 168 for 10 - 15 min / or no mash out.

another recipe called for a 60-90 min at ## and with a longer mash out,
u get what asking?

why is it different? are they getting something out of this... flavor or more fermentables? or non fermentables?

or is it just personal preference?

__________________
hopsoda is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-07-2009, 08:30 PM   #4
BrewDey
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Cincinnati
Posts: 457
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

My understanding is that the longer you mash, the more sugars (fermentable and non-fermentable) will be extracted. I do 90 minutes-both because it gives the enzymes time to work, and because it gives me enough time to get everything else in order.

For temps, my simple rule is that closer to 150=more fermentables and a dryer beer...closer to 160=less fermentables and a sweeter beer.

__________________
BrewDey is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-07-2009, 08:56 PM   #5
bbrim
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Posts: 707
Liked 17 Times on 15 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

With a lower temp mash you will have more beta amalyse activity, at the higher end more alpha activity. The alpha break chains of sugar molecules, whereas beta tears individual molecules off a chain one at a time. Higher temp mashes will convert more quickly but leave more complex sugars in the wort, some of which will be unfermentable. Lower temp mashes will take longer but create a wort that is more fermentable. If you want a beer to have a really low finishing gravity you'll want to mash around 148-150 but you may want to run up to 90 minutes to allow complete conversion. However if you want a fuller body you'll run 154-156 and maybe even up to 158. You're conversion could be done as quickly as 45 minutes but more likely in the neighborhood of 60. The best way to be sure conversion is complete is to use an iodine test.

__________________
bbrim is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-07-2009, 08:57 PM   #6
Yooper
Frau Admin
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Yooper's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Upper Michigan
Posts: 58,585
Liked 3848 Times on 2812 Posts
Likes Given: 639

Default

If you use an iodine test for conversion, you can mash for as short as a time as it takes for conversion- maybe 20-30 minutes even.

Mashing for an hour pretty much ensures full conversion, so that's what many of us do that don't always do a iodine test. A shorter mash time can mean a less fermentable wort, and a longer mash time can mean a more fermentable wort but it doesn't seem to have as big as impact as the temperature does during the mash.

Step mashing is a different beast- they usually include different "rests" for different purposes. Like a protein rest, for example.

Howtobrew.com has more information on different rests in a step mash and what the purpose is. Most of today's well-modified malt is fine with a single infusion mash.

__________________
Broken Leg Brewery
Giving beer a leg to stand on since 2006
Yooper is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-07-2009, 09:21 PM   #7
hopsoda
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Iowa
Posts: 289
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Thank you all , so mashing at higher temps will give my beer more body, and lower temps will result in a dryer beer, OK that explaines some flavor changes in some of my batches

__________________
hopsoda is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-09-2009, 05:21 PM   #8
Denny
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Eugene OR
Posts: 4,113
Liked 384 Times on 292 Posts
Likes Given: 388

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by YooperBrew View Post
If you use an iodine test for conversion, you can mash for as short as a time as it takes for conversion- maybe 20-30 minutes even.
There's a difference between conversion and dextrine profile, though. Sure you can convert in as little as 15 minutes, but will you get the sugar profile that's right for the beer?
__________________

Life begins at 60....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

http://www.experimentalbrew.com - the website for the book "Experimental Homebrewing"...coming Nov. 2014

Denny is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-09-2009, 05:42 PM   #9
Got Trub?
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Washington State
Posts: 1,538
Liked 7 Times on 5 Posts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denny View Post
There's a difference between conversion and dextrine profile, though. Sure you can convert in as little as 15 minutes, but will you get the sugar profile that's right for the beer?
Yes, if you use the correct mash temperature. With todays highly modified malts the enzymatic conversion is completed in much less then the 60 minutes many of us mash for. Efficiency will suffer though if you shorten your mash time.

GT
__________________
Got Trub? is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-09-2009, 06:10 PM   #10
Piotr
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Poland, EU
Posts: 463
Liked 4 Times on 3 Posts

Default

When I mash in 154F iodine test is usually negative in ~30 min. But I keep it whole 60 min, unless I intentionally want poorly fermentable wort.



__________________
Piotr is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mash Times smarek82 All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 19 05-07-2009 08:24 PM
Mash Times? hopdawg All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 4 03-01-2009 08:00 AM
Decoction Mash Times? Eastside Brewer General Techniques 8 09-02-2008 03:59 PM
Mash Temps/Times Kayos All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 3 10-23-2007 06:58 AM
Have you experimented with Mash Times? Monk All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 3 09-19-2007 08:53 PM