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oldthomas · 10-14-2012, 02:33 AM

My question is whether or not only a FWH addition will bitter adequately. I've used the technique but have never made a recipe with only a FWH addition. I'm more or less committed to the recipe below, but I'd like to hear from the experienced. How would you describe your FWH only beers?

Recipe:
10# Maris Otter
3# Rye
1# Special B
2 oz Willamette FWH
WY3522 yeast

Thoughts?

**thughes** · 10-14-2012, 02:39 AM

I've done FWH and dry hop. FWH is nice but you're going to be lacking in the aroma department with the final product.

**helibrewer** · 10-14-2012, 05:06 AM

I don't do IPA's but I do FWH all my other beers (Belgians and German lagers mostly). Any aroma hops go in at flameout, no hops in between FWH and flameout.

Boy · 10-14-2012, 05:59 AM

You generally need to up the amounts since a FWH is closer to a 20min add in IBUs. I'd also recommend a dry hop for the aroma

oldthomas · 10-14-2012, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by helibrewer

I don't do IPA's but I do FWH all my other beers (Belgians and German lagers mostly). Any aroma hops go in at flameout, no hops in between FWH and flameout.

Could you give me an example Belgian recipe that was a success?

**thughes** · 10-14-2012, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boy

You generally need to up the amounts since a FWH is closer to a 20min add in IBUs. I'd also recommend a dry hop for the aroma

With all due respect, why is this? Have you experimented to confirm this yourself? I know this is the oft-repeated "common knowledge" but I have done a few side-by-side tests with standard 60 minute addtition vs exact same amount as FWH. The percieved bitterness seemed the same to me and others that have tasted the experiments but there is something "different" about the FWH bittering. It's much more mellow and seems to hit the back off your tongue as it finishes.

The reason I did the experiments is that no one could tell me why hops that were boiled for over 60 minutes (FWH) should result in LESS bitterness than the standard 60 minute boil of bittering hops. So, why should a standard bittering charge boiled for 60 minutes give you "x" amount of IBU's but the same amount done as a FWH (and boiled longer than 60 minutes) only give you 20 minutes worth of IBU's?

I'm not trying to be combative, just so tired of the same old "truths" being repeated constantly and taken as gospel. Doesn't anybody else think to challenege these facts that just don't seem "right" or am I just some kind of rebellious freak?

Denny · 10-14-2012, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boy

You generally need to up the amounts since a FWH is closer to a 20min add in IBUs. I'd also recommend a dry hop for the aroma

That's my experience also.

Denny · 10-14-2012, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thughes

With all due respect, why is this? Have you experimented to confirm this yourself? I know this is the oft-repeated "common knowledge" but I have done a few side-by-side tests with standard 60 minute addtition vs exact same amount as FWH. The percieved bitterness seemed the same to me and others that have tasted the experiments but there is something "different" about the FWH bittering. It's much more mellow and seems to hit the back off your tongue as it finishes.

The reason I did the experiments is that no one could tell me why hops that were boiled for over 60 minutes (FWH) should result in LESS bitterness than the standard 60 minute boil of bittering hops. So, why should a standard bittering charge boiled for 60 minutes give you "x" amount of IBU's but the same amount done as a FWH (and boiled longer than 60 minutes) only give you 20 minutes worth of IBU's?

I'm not trying to be combative, just so tired of the same old "truths" being repeated constantly and taken as gospel. Doesn't anybody else think to challenege these facts that just don't seem "right" or am I just some kind of rebellious freak?

I have done the experiment and had the beers measured. I had many tasters in a blind triangle tasting. My conclusion is that although the FWH only beers measured about 10% more IBU, they tasted less bitter.

**thughes** · 10-14-2012, 06:25 PM

So the measured IBU is actually higher? That would seem to confirm the theory that the longer boil of the FWH does result in more IBU.

I suppose that the "perceived" bitterness could be subjective dependent upon the individual taster? Perhaps the FWH bittering being less "harsh" could be construed as "less" bitter? Too many variables related to the palate of the individuals doing the tasting but I am glad to see that the actual measurement supports the thoery that longer boil = higher IBU (even though the perception of those higher IBU's in different). Thanks for the input!

**Glynn** · 10-14-2012, 06:26 PM

I'm going with rebellious freak lol