Ss Brewing Technologies Giveaway!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Techniques > First Competition Results
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 09-12-2012, 07:58 PM   #1
HenryKDuff
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 38
Default First Competition Results

I just received the results from my first competition - a recently brewed IPA (14B) I (and every civilian who tasted it) absolutely loved and a porter (12B) I brewed a year ago and happened to have some bottles left.

Of course, my beloved IPA received a pedestrian 24.5 and the porter I thought to be decent but unspectacular came in 4th overall (third in flight) with a score of 34.6.

The IPA got dinged pretty heavily for diacetyl and the recommendations I got were for things I already did - use a yeast like 1056 (I used S-05) and give the yeast more time to clean up (I did a 4 week primary).

I tried researching the subject before bugging you fine people, but the overwhelming majority of material on the subject concerns the diacetyl rest for lagers. The judges didn't seem to think infection was the cause. 4 weeks is time enough for the yeast to clean up, correct? Are there other likely causes that I'm missing? This was my first use of the beer gun, could I be oxidizing somehow (I thought I purged the bottles sufficiently)?

__________________
HenryKDuff is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-12-2012, 09:44 PM   #2
jhall4
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Pleasanton, California
Posts: 150
Liked 11 Times on 10 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

If you received a deduction for oxidation then sure, you might have oxidized your beer at some point - whether it's during a transfer or during bottling it's hard to say.

That said, if your primary deduction was diacetyl, then it's likely a fermentation problem. The judges know their stuff and they're not going to confuse two off flavors like that.

I would guess that your problem was that either initial fermentation temps were too high OR that diacetyl rest temps were too low.

__________________
jhall4 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-12-2012, 09:48 PM   #3
Yooper
Ale's What Cures You!
HBT_ADMIN.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Yooper's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Upper Michigan
Posts: 61,017
Liked 4451 Times on 3240 Posts
Likes Given: 866

Default

Diacetyl can come from stressed yeast- so underpitching could be a cause of diacetyl in a not-usually-full-of-diacetyl yeast strain. A long lag time could contribute to diacetyl, for example, as could a lack of aeration prior to fermentation.

It can come from infection, notably pediococcus, as well.

__________________
Broken Leg Brewery
Giving beer a leg to stand on since 2006
Yooper is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-12-2012, 10:05 PM   #4
HenryKDuff
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 38
Default

I only mentioned oxidation because something I came across mentioned introducing too much oxygen in transfer as a possible diacetyl cause.

I aerated with O2 and didn't have any lag time issue. I haven't been hydrating my dry yeast, so I suppose underpitching is possible. I'll rehydrate (or pitch two packs) next time and see if it makes a difference.

Of course, the bottom line is the taste for me and the people who drink with me and everyone loved it. But it's nice to know what diacetyl actually tastes like after seeing so many references to it. Thanks to both you for your feedback.

__________________
HenryKDuff is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-12-2012, 11:06 PM   #5
jhall4
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Pleasanton, California
Posts: 150
Liked 11 Times on 10 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Oh, gotcha. Yeah, I don't think that's a concern as far as diacetyl is concerned. Whatever diacetyl is going to be in your beer has long since been formed by that stage.

__________________
jhall4 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-13-2012, 02:31 AM   #6
mobly99
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
mobly99's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Waukegan
Posts: 196
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Scores often tend to be more about how well the beer you made matched the criteria for the style (or the judges interpretation thereof) than anything else. Sure you will get dinged for any defects, but a great beer entered in the wrong category can be the difference between a 25 and a 35. Despite what a jhall4 says about the judges knowing their stuff, I will counter with some judges know their stuff. Some competitions do not have BJCP certified judges for all of their judges. Did you have more than one judge judging your beer? What level of judge were they? Were the scores and comments very close to each other?

__________________

Primary: Revelation Cream Ale
On Tap: Red Skies at Night, LHB Blond Ale, 224? Suburban Wheat Ale

mobly99 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-13-2012, 02:41 AM   #7
mobly99
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
mobly99's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Waukegan
Posts: 196
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

I should also note that I have had the same beer score vastly differently in two competitions. I had an American Barleywine score a 29.5 with lesser experienced judges (apprentice/certified) with mentions of dicetyl and astringency and a month later got a 42 from a BJCP National judge who I talked to later and said there was absolutely no diacetyl or astringency. To some degree score are arbitrary, granted a barleywine can get better with age, but a month to go from a 29.5 to 42?

__________________

Primary: Revelation Cream Ale
On Tap: Red Skies at Night, LHB Blond Ale, 224? Suburban Wheat Ale

mobly99 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-13-2012, 03:17 AM   #8
AnchorBock
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 578
Liked 30 Times on 23 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default

The best thing is to enter the same beer in multiple competitions so you can locate consistencies and disregard one off comments.

__________________

Homebrewing blog: http://bagendbrewery.wordpress.com

Beer Engine Caskegerator - Hand pump/keg enclosure for Real Ale at home.

AnchorBock is offline
PseudoChef Likes This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-13-2012, 03:25 AM   #9
mobly99
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
mobly99's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Waukegan
Posts: 196
Liked 2 Times on 2 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnchorBock View Post
The best thing is to enter the same beer in multiple competitions so you can locate consistencies and disregard one off comments.
100% agree. If you are thinking of entering one competition, enter the same beer in two more and compare the scores and comments.
__________________

Primary: Revelation Cream Ale
On Tap: Red Skies at Night, LHB Blond Ale, 224? Suburban Wheat Ale

mobly99 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-13-2012, 04:37 AM   #10
HenryKDuff
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 38
Default

The IPA was judged by two judges, one National and one Recognized. They both indicated diacetyl.

I'd rather have a beer I find delicious than one that pleases strangers (certified or not), but it is interesting to get notes from experienced people who have no incentive to save your feelings.

__________________
HenryKDuff is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Whirlpool not getting the results I want. zanemoseley General Techniques 11 11-09-2010 02:07 AM
Brew in a Bag technique - Competition results BargainFittings General Techniques 3 03-22-2009 07:40 PM
Some interesting results DeadYetiBrew General Techniques 9 05-31-2008 06:01 AM
Kolsch Results jeffg General Techniques 0 06-11-2006 01:35 PM