Ss Brewing Technologies Giveaway!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > General Techniques > Closed-system pressurized fermentation technique!
View Poll Results: What do you guys think about pressure fermentations? Time for a poll.
I've done it and I liked it just fine! 82 11.34%
I've done it, nothing wrong with it, but prefer normal fermentation techniques. 20 2.77%
I've done it, hate it, and never will do it again! 4 0.55%
I've never done it, but it is on my list! 538 74.41%
I've never done anything. I only brew beer in my mind. 79 10.93%
Voters: 723. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-16-2011, 03:19 AM   #641
WortMonger
United States Mashtronaut
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
WortMonger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Edmond, OK, Oklahoma
Posts: 3,141
Liked 28 Times on 27 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

See, Dgonza9 is doing it ALL WRONG and his beer is turning out great! LOL, That's one fine cat pelt you got there sir. Skin that putty any way you can... RIGHT? It all works, just do it to make your life easier.

D, love that RIMS tube buddy. Nice setup!

__________________
"Beer... Nutritious and Delicious!"

"It's like a 15.5 gallon Mr. Beer!"
WortMonger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-17-2011, 04:49 PM   #642
WortMonger
United States Mashtronaut
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
WortMonger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Edmond, OK, Oklahoma
Posts: 3,141
Liked 28 Times on 27 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

If you guys post the information you wish was there, I can put it there no problem.

__________________
"Beer... Nutritious and Delicious!"

"It's like a 15.5 gallon Mr. Beer!"
WortMonger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-17-2011, 11:45 PM   #643
flananuts
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
flananuts's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Monmouth County, NJ
Posts: 507
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Hey there closed pressure dudes. A quick update on my stuck backyard Pale Ale from a few weeks ago. It never made it's target FG but I went through kegging it anyway. Unfortunately this became my first batch down the drain ever. Two major issues happened. My AA were way off he freaking chart. Being that they were grown in the backyard I have no idea what their AA were. Anyhoo, tihe beer looked beautiful but could be used to clean toilets and Ram's piss woudd prolly taste better( or train you for beer drinking contests).

I just kegged an IPA that was freaking delishi and well received by our dinner guests. They couldnt believe that I had just kegged the beer that morning and that it was so good that soon. I just love pressure fermentation.

My SWMBO has requested a lager and I have an American, bavarian, and pilsner yeast to work with. Anyone have a SWMBO slayer that've pressure fermented and was a hit?

__________________
flananuts is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-18-2011, 02:31 AM   #644
WortMonger
United States Mashtronaut
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
WortMonger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Edmond, OK, Oklahoma
Posts: 3,141
Liked 28 Times on 27 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

I did a Czech pils with just pilsner malt that was wonderful. Weirdly enough it was slightly sweet until the keg was almost gone. I did a low mash temperature and a very long primary. It was also cut with water to make it lighter, but at over 5% it slayed everyone that drank it. Sacch did a warmer fermented lager under pressure he said was great.

__________________
"Beer... Nutritious and Delicious!"

"It's like a 15.5 gallon Mr. Beer!"
WortMonger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-19-2011, 07:32 PM   #645
gr8shandini
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Philly
Posts: 800
Liked 56 Times on 43 Posts

Default

Hey all,

I'd like to say I read all of this post, but I crapped out after 50 pages. Please forgive me if these questions have already been answered. Long story short, I'm looking to use cornies for now while I look for a legal way to obtain a pony keg. So here's what's still rattling around in my head:

1. Regarding ester suppression and fermentation temperature: what if your beer style is an estery one? One of the benefits listed is lower ester production which allows for higher fermentation temps. However, my normal hiding spot for my fermenter is about 64F in the winter. If I ferment under pressure, will I risk making something too "clean" for those styles unless I move it to a warmer part of the house?

2. To the guys using a soda bottle as a catch can: how do you tie it in to the system? Do the threads match fittings I can find at a hardware store or when I place my order at McMaster/Grainger?

3. My normal practice is to cold crash the fermenter and add gelatin to the keg before racking. Is this even necessary if I put a racking tip on the dip tube and draw off a pint or two before doing the counterpressure transfer? Or, if I'm spending a few bucks anyway, should I just get myself a filter?

4. I'm also intrigued by the "high gravity" method (blending in plain H20 at the end), but that idea seemed to get abandoned pretty early in the thread. Any comments from the folks who have tried it?

Thanks,

__________________
gr8shandini is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2011, 02:06 AM   #646
cmuench
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northfield, MN USA
Posts: 107
Default

I'm on my third 15 gal batch of closed pressure fermentation. The technique has a lot of appeal for me in its simplicity, but I must admit I've been very frustrated during high krausen.

I know I only have 0.5 gal of head space but I thought I could get away with it.

I used 2 drops of fermcap S per gal on the second batch and I'm not sure it made any difference. Forgot to use it on this third batch and I've got a mess.

It only takes a small bit of hop particulate to clog the PRV then the pressure quickly goes to 20. I've taken it off several times to clean it out but it plugs in just a few seconds.

I finally gave up and put a blow off tube on my setup. In another 24 hours when things settle down I'll put the PRV back on and start to dial it up.

Any other suggestions???

__________________
cmuench is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-20-2011, 03:38 AM   #647
WortMonger
United States Mashtronaut
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
WortMonger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Edmond, OK, Oklahoma
Posts: 3,141
Liked 28 Times on 27 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gr8shandini View Post
Hey all,

I'd like to say I read all of this post, but I crapped out after 50 pages. Please forgive me if these questions have already been answered. Long story short, I'm looking to use cornies for now while I look for a legal way to obtain a pony keg. So here's what's still rattling around in my head:

1. Regarding ester suppression and fermentation temperature: what if your beer style is an estery one? One of the benefits listed is lower ester production which allows for higher fermentation temps. However, my normal hiding spot for my fermenter is about 64F in the winter. If I ferment under pressure, will I risk making something too "clean" for those styles unless I move it to a warmer part of the house?
I can only assume that it will make a beer too un-estery. In theory from the research, yes. You would have to do your own experiments to conclude what is proposed from the lessening ester formation, ie. maybe a higher temperature fermentation. I just don't know because clean beers are all I have been after in my pursuits.
Quote:
2. To the guys using a soda bottle as a catch can: how do you tie it in to the system? Do the threads match fittings I can find at a hardware store or when I place my order at McMaster/Grainger?
I don't know of anyone using the soda bottles as of yet. I proposed it as an idea I would like to try to keep my equipment from being gunked up with the little bit (but still annoying) of krausening yeast that comes out during the ferment. If you rig something up and use it, please let us all know how it turned out for you.
Quote:
3. My normal practice is to cold crash the fermenter and add gelatin to the keg before racking. Is this even necessary if I put a racking tip on the dip tube and draw off a pint or two before doing the counterpressure transfer? Or, if I'm spending a few bucks anyway, should I just get myself a filter?
Again, up for debate. Adding gelatin would be great, but you can't and keep a closed system. I had no problem transferring after enough time to get relatively yeast free beer in a transfer keg. The little bit that got in at the start was easily drawn off in the first couple of pints after tapping to serve. I do recommend a filter, and have gone that route now myself. I have been using it pre-tap, but planned on using it during my counter-pressure transfer from primary to serving keg. It has just worked out this time to use it in the fashion I am.
Quote:
4. I'm also intrigued by the "high gravity" method (blending in plain H20 at the end), but that idea seemed to get abandoned pretty early in the thread. Any comments from the folks who have tried it?

Thanks,
Not abandoned, just not the focus of the thread so I don't elaborate much about it. I really enjoy brewing 12 gallons in my kettle and then using the last 3 to help start my chill and get my finishing volume. I wrote a wiki article about it as well as closed-system pressure fermentation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmuench View Post
I'm on my third 15 gal batch of closed pressure fermentation. The technique has a lot of appeal for me in its simplicity, but I must admit I've been very frustrated during high krausen.

I know I only have 0.5 gal of head space but I thought I could get away with it.

I used 2 drops of fermcap S per gal on the second batch and I'm not sure it made any difference. Forgot to use it on this third batch and I've got a mess.

It only takes a small bit of hop particulate to clog the PRV then the pressure quickly goes to 20. I've taken it off several times to clean it out but it plugs in just a few seconds.

I finally gave up and put a blow off tube on my setup. In another 24 hours when things settle down I'll put the PRV back on and start to dial it up.

Any other suggestions???
Sorry to hear that, but completely understand going to a blow off tube. The spunding technique will probably do you better at the end of primary, and as you know is easy enough to hook up at that point to get your natural carbonation. This last experiment was all higher pressures and I still got dirty. Waste was kept to a small amount, but lets face it... even the smallest bit of krausen in your equipment is nasty. I ended up with a little over a cup of liquid nastiness on the floor around my keg this past brew. The wife was not happy and I had to keep removing the spunding valve assembly and cleaning it to make sure I didn't have an excessive pressure build up. My fault for getting greedy with fermentor space, but worth it because it means I have to come up with a way to get past that... and I love a good challenge.
__________________
"Beer... Nutritious and Delicious!"

"It's like a 15.5 gallon Mr. Beer!"
WortMonger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-23-2011, 11:39 PM   #648
WortMonger
United States Mashtronaut
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
WortMonger's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Edmond, OK, Oklahoma
Posts: 3,141
Liked 28 Times on 27 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default New wiki update!

Ok guys, another wiki update. Let me know what you think.

__________________
"Beer... Nutritious and Delicious!"

"It's like a 15.5 gallon Mr. Beer!"
WortMonger is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-24-2011, 03:09 AM   #649
cmuench
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northfield, MN USA
Posts: 107
Default

Wort

The wiki looks great!! A couple of feedback points if I may...

The link for "lautering grant is part of my pump setup" under the procedure paragraph does not work.

Typo under summary of process, the paragraph after #4, first line "and then spund at the lest part of primary" should be last.

Other than those small details, I thought it was awesome!

In the wiki you state "I like to go with higher pressures from the start to keep my krausen down". Do you think this really makes a difference? Any drawbacks in doing so? The pressures you described on your latest brown are much higher than what you were doing earlier in the thread.

I went with the blow off tube for the first 24-36 hours on my Kolsch, it was far less messy, but I don't want to get kicked out of the "club" for using a blow off!

__________________
cmuench is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-24-2011, 04:56 AM   #650
kaiser423
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 487
Liked 4 Times on 4 Posts
Likes Given: 1

Default

Nice wiki update. It has a very good explanation of the process. I thin ksome more info about the actual pressures used and their impact would be good; it's the item that I have the most quesitons about.

Kaiser has mentioend that fermenting at 5psi was similar to the hydrostatic pressure experienced in larger breweries, so he didn't consider it to truly be under-pressure.

He also had that fun graph

One thing also to mention was in that last interview with Jamil and Palmer, they talked about how autolysis not happening in homebreweries might be due to the decreased pressure that the yeast at the bottom of the fermenter experience due to the size/shape of our fermenters. But leaving a fermented brew on the yeast for 1+ month under pressure might? dunno.


I have my batch in the corny going right now. I put ~6 feet of tubing between the quick disconnect and the spunding valve and coiled it up. That way I figure that if I do end up with blowoff, it won't make it to the valve, and I can quickly disconnect the tubing and flush it if need be.

I didn't aerate, but made a large starter from real wort (since i no chilled the batch), pitched at high krausen after letting it sit overnight and 5 hours later has it ramp up to 5+ psi, so it went pretty well. I have the valve set for 10 psi, and will jack it up after a couple of days I think.

On that valve, how many turns approximately per psi? Say, if I want to go up 5 psi from where I'm at, is that 1 turn, 5 turns, 10 turns?

I think that I'm going to dry hop by depressurizing after final pressure and diacetyl rest, putting the hops in, then cold crash for a week and then counter-pressure transfer. Although I might put the hops in another corny, purge it with CO2, then transfer that across. Then after a week, transfer again....that might be a bit better, and give me clearer beer in the end...

My main concerns at this point are 1) Clogging my dip tube since I didn't do a stellar job of removing the trub and 2) I wildly missed my mash-in temp (aka, may have denatured the enzymes), so the ferment might stop a bit early and I may need to push it further with some amylase enzyme to get it down to the desired FG.

__________________
kaiser423 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Teri Fahrendorf's article on Closed System Pressurized Fermentation WortMonger General Techniques 6 12-15-2012 01:40 PM
Closed System Wort Cooling Works The Pol Equipment/Sanitation 32 10-15-2009 10:58 PM
Closed System Brewing Kettle....Project fifelee DIY Projects 19 10-10-2008 03:08 PM
Carboy to Keg - Closed system Orfy Bottling/Kegging 3 09-02-2007 04:50 PM
Closed system racking Brewing Clamper Bottling/Kegging 5 08-17-2007 09:02 PM