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Old 10-13-2005, 08:12 PM   #21
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Mashing is not that complicated.

Any malt that has been roasted to color should be consitered a non-enzmatic malt, any whole grain is non-enzmatic. Any starch adjunct, must be pre boiled before mashing.

Three simple rules. for mashing.

Infusion mast at 153 +/- degrees. Slightly higher for more unfermentables and slightly lower for more fermentables.

You must have an equal amount of base (non roasted) malt to the amount of roasted malt and adjuncts. (Carapils should be consitered roasted)

Use 1 qt per pound of total grains and adjuncts.

Follow these three guidelines and you are mashing.

Use too much water and you're not.

Don't add the equal amount of base malt and you're not.

Don't hold the temp between 149 and 159 and you're not.

Simple stuff.

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Old 10-14-2005, 02:05 AM   #22
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This has possibly been said, but i think the problem with not mashing "must be mashed" grains is that they will then contribute a lot of starch to your beer, and this will affect clarity etc.

If that's not a concern, then go for it.

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Old 10-14-2005, 02:55 AM   #23
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is this something a fining agent might strip out? (I don't care about clarity, but having the knowledge is good.)

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Old 10-14-2005, 04:51 AM   #24
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Depending on how much "must be mashed" grain / adjuct used, you'll end up with Jill's Starch-blob-o-doom in your fermenter. I'd guess that a fining agent might be effective since the starches seem to be "heavy".

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Old 10-14-2005, 06:42 AM   #25
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Good call, LU. I racked to the primary and pitched maybe a half hour ago, and I already have 4 inches of sludge at the bottom of it. I guess this is either one massive pile of yeast from my starter, or a bunch of starch. Either way, I'm going to have to lose a decent bit of this batch when I rack to the secondary.

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Old 10-14-2005, 01:37 PM   #26
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Good news.

I checked the fermenter this morning before coming to work. That 4 inches of sludge has compressed to about 1.5 inches.

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Old 10-18-2005, 02:47 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LupusUmbrus
Depending on how much "must be mashed" grain / adjuct used, you'll end up with Jill's Starch-blob-o-doom in your fermenter.
I was thinking about this and I don't believe this is true.

Since the only difference between what I do and a true "mash" is the way I rinse the grains, I HAVE converted starch to sugar, just like a true masher would have done (right temp, right water amount, right amount of time).... I am simply not getting all of the sugar out of the grain in the end. The starch shouldn't be there.

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Old 10-18-2005, 03:00 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walker
I was thinking about this and I don't believe this is true.

Since the only difference between what I do and a true "mash" is the way I rinse the grains, I HAVE converted starch to sugar, just like a true masher would have done (right temp, right water amount, right amount of time).... I am simply not getting all of the sugar out of the grain in the end. The starch shouldn't be there.

-walker
Quite right. Had the wires crossed there, as there is a distinction between "must be mashed" grains, and adjucts that need to be mashed with "must be mashed" grains. That being that the grains have the enzymes needed to convert their own starches while the adjucts (unmalted grain, oats, etc) do not.

I wonder what your sludge was... Maybe hop pellet stuff?
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Old 10-18-2005, 03:03 PM   #29
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Ok.... in MY specific case, I had some issues, remember? I got the grains too hot, so I would have stopped the starch->sugar conversion when I got above 170 degrees. So, in my case the sludge was probably hops, yeast, and starch.

HOWEVER, in the general (not-f'ed-up) case, the starch would have been converted.

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Old 10-18-2005, 03:04 PM   #30
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on a related note, that beer has developed a SECOND krauesen head. This one is gummy-looking, and I think it's because of the starch.

I probably will try to use gelatin to fine this one, just in case.

-walker

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