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Old 01-07-2010, 06:12 AM   #31
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Fear not g-510, we shall find a way!

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Old 01-07-2010, 02:18 PM   #32
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is there any way to get Mg without overloading SO4?

to emulate, say, milwaukee water (47ppm Mg, 26ppm SO4) you need relatively high Mg and relatively low SO4.

Is epsom salt the only way to get Mg? It has too high levels SO4....

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Old 01-07-2010, 02:42 PM   #33
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Subscribed.. im just starting to dabble with water chemistry. I also recently purchased a 5 stage RO system so I can start to collect my brewing water. It would be awsome if that spreadsheet exists so I can do quick reference.

I still want to study the ions and figure out additions on my own but Id like to be able to check it.

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Old 01-07-2010, 02:57 PM   #34
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there are several programs out there that do all of the calculations for you

http://home.roadrunner.com/~brewbeer....html#Software

is one, and its pretty good, and those that say they only know styles and not water profiles, well if you know a style you know where it was that made it famous right? whammo thats you water profile to use, and you can get your water profile from your locat utility

About the Mg, and SO4 for Milwaukee water, the only issue I have with most brewing salts calculators is that they dont take other minerals into the equation, i.e. iron, sometimes you just cant balance the water without additional ions/cations, and using other salts (if you can get them) can help with this, as far as the pH is concerned beersmith is terrible at salts calculations because it doesnt take this into account, it just blindly assumes that it will be dissolved and in the form you want

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Old 01-07-2010, 05:22 PM   #35
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So which styles do we want to cover?

If possible, put your suggestion in the form of a water profile. Don't worry about duplication and/or conflicting profiles. We can hash out the details as we progress.

(I'll come back with a couple later today)

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Old 01-07-2010, 05:32 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motobrewer View Post
is there any way to get Mg without overloading SO4?

to emulate, say, milwaukee water (47ppm Mg, 26ppm SO4) you need relatively high Mg and relatively low SO4.

Is epsom salt the only way to get Mg? It has too high levels SO4....
MgCl2 would be another Mg source, but it's use would depend on your chloride levels. A pharmacy or a health food store should stock magnesium chloride supplements (Magnacaps or Uro-Mag). I can't find a product sheet for these supplements, so I don't know if there is any filler that's compressed into the tablet.
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Old 01-07-2010, 06:50 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arturo7 View Post
I imagine those that know WTF goes on with all of this chemistry are sitting on the sidelines getting a good chuckle out of this thread.
chuckle chuckle...

j/k. I wouldn't consider myself an expert but I will suggest that even though I think you have a good idea here, I would keep in mind that each style has quite a range of colors, IBU's, etc. and I'm not sure that one-size-fits-all profiles will work so well for each style. For example, IPA's can have an SRM of 6, or an SRM of 15. I would likely adjust my water (particularly Residual Alkalinity) differently in each of those two cases.

I'm not saying to give up, keep working it out and maybe something will come from this that I can incorporate my spreadsheet (see sig). I'll try to help out too along the way...
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Old 01-07-2010, 07:41 PM   #38
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Just a thought...


Could this be as easy as using a mash pH stabilizer and adjusting the chloride to sulfate ratio to meet the desired SRM?

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Old 01-07-2010, 08:22 PM   #39
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When adjusting your water you are really trying to do these 3 things at once:

#1. Get the Residual Alkalinity (RA) of your water to a level that coincides with the color (SRM) of your recipe. This is to ensure that your mash will be at the proper pH.

#2. Get the Cloride to Sulfate ratio within a range that corresponds to the style you are brewing (ie. bitter, balanced, malty). This is will enhance flavor.

#3. Get the individual minerals (Ca, Mg, Na, Cl, SO4) to acceptable (or even desirable) levels. Keep in mind that by the time you accomplish items #1 and #2, it becomes difficult to manipulate these much anymore, except for maybe as a whole or groups. I personally shoot for Palmer's recommended ranges. Some try to match city profiles or I suppose you could try to come up with profiles by style, but like I said you probably won't have the freedom to do much other than get within Palmer's ranges. Palmer discusses mineral levels here: http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/chapter15-1.html scroll down some.

Check out my spreadsheet at www.ezwatercalculator.com if you haven't already and play around with it.

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Last edited by -TH-; 01-07-2010 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 01-10-2010, 02:41 PM   #40
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I use RO water, and after doing a little research, I am making water profiles in beersmith for Cream ales, pale ales, amber, brown, IPA, and stout. I just make the profiles based on other reviews/recommendations I find. I am not sure how to tweek them myself yet. They all taste pretty good so far.

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