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Old 03-10-2013, 03:50 PM   #21
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alright but what about residual calcium? will I have to add more?

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Old 03-10-2013, 04:37 PM   #22
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Yes. You have 6.7 mval alkalinity and 5.2 calcium hardness. You will want to increase the calcium by adding sulfate or chloride in ratio that depends on how much sulfate and chloride you ultimately want to get the calcium hardness up to at least 6.7. That should, if the rule of thumb applies closely to your case, get you to about 1 mval (50 ppm as CaCO3) each alkalinity and hardness. You really should test to see what you actually get (test kits are available from companies such as Hach, LaMotte, Cole Parmer... and from aquarium and pool suppliers). If more than the 1 mval calcium is wanted then extra sulfate and/or chloride need to be added but do it before the heat or lime treatment as you may be able to get the bicarbonate down a bit below 1 mval and every bit helps.

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Old 03-11-2013, 04:00 PM   #23
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how long does this take to settle out? I mixed up a trash can full of water last night- looked today and it's still on the cloudy side.

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Old 03-11-2013, 04:06 PM   #24
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also, ajdelange, you spoke of adding sulfate or chloride to the water in a ratio, at wahat ratio do I add those things?

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Old 03-11-2013, 04:08 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runningweird View Post
also, ajdelange, you spoke of adding sulfate or chloride to the water in a ratio, at wahat ratio do I add those things?
You need to add that extra calcium before you do the treatment, btw. Calcium is used in the reaction (You're forming CaCO3.), so if you don't have enough you'll end up with leftover lime in the water.
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Old 03-11-2013, 05:09 PM   #26
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If you want to play with the chemistry of slaked lime treatment use this calculator:

http://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-ch...or/?id=CNJVQX2

It was not released yet when I first posted in this thread. The section were to control the precipitation is “Boiling and Lime Softening”. If you also open the “Mash Water before Dough-In” section you can see the predicted pH, alkalinity, etc.

You’ll also notice that with added calcium your alkalinity is able to drop further just like afr0byte said.

Kai

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Old 03-11-2013, 05:26 PM   #27
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If you want to play with the chemistry of slaked lime treatment use this calculator:

http://www.brewersfriend.com/mash-ch...or/?id=CNJVQX2

It was not released yet when I first posted in this thread. The section were to control the precipitation is “Boiling and Lime Softening”. If you also open the “Mash Water before Dough-In” section you can see the predicted pH, alkalinity, etc.

You’ll also notice that with added calcium your alkalinity is able to drop further just like afr0byte said.

Kai


looks neat, I'll play around with it over lunch.
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Old 03-11-2013, 05:30 PM   #28
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how long does this take to settle out? I mixed up a trash can full of water last night- looked today and it's still on the cloudy side.
If the particles are finely divided it can take a long time and if it takes too long atmospheric CO2 will enter the water and the particles will redissolve. To get larger particles try adding some chalk to the water before adding the lime. The lime that precipitates will tend to precipitate onto those particles and thus should settle faster. Also, be sure you are stirring throughout the whole process as this give the particles opportunity to flocculate. You could also add a small amount of aluminum chloride or ferric chloride. This is what a water treatment plant does to get particulates to settle. But you have to be careful to get the right amounts (determined by experiment) as you don't want ferric or aluminum ion in your beer.

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also, ajdelange, you spoke of adding sulfate or chloride to the water in a ratio, at wahat ratio do I add those things?
Whatever ratio you like! By this I mean that some people don't like the effects of sulfate and some people love it and some people love it is ales and hate it in lagers so it is a trial and error thing. I always recommend starting with straight chloride and adding some sulfate in the glass to see if they like the effect. If they do they then brew with sulfate next time.
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:35 PM   #29
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okay, so I just tested my water experiment - my pool store test strips gave me a pH of 8.4
and alkalinity of 40 ppm

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Old 03-11-2013, 06:42 PM   #30
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Declare Victory and have a beer. You got your alkalinity down to below the rule of thumb 1 mEq/L (though with a pool test kit 40 could easily mean 50).

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