NYC 2010 Water Report

**Airborneguy** · 04-10-2011, 08:09 PM

Figured some other people here might be interested in seeing this. It's the mst recent water report for NYC public water. Just came to my house this week.

If you copy the picture then blow it up, it is readable

ajfranke · 04-23-2011, 02:58 PM

There's also a PDF version available here:

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dep/pdf/wsstate10.pdf

The above-posted data sheet is on page 10.

To be an obvious newbie: Are there any aspects of this water which are blatantly in need of improvement, for brewing purposes?

**ajdelange** · 04-23-2011, 03:57 PM

This is actually very nice water in the sense that it is so low in minerals that it is almost comparable to RO water. As such you can brew many types of beer with it if you use acid judiciously to control mash pH. Most beers would benefit from supplementation of the calcium with either the chloride (you want a full bodied, sweet, round, soft beer) or the sulfate (you want forward hops, a dry, thinner beer) or a bit of each for something in between. The Primer in the stickies will give you some general guidelines.

mabrungard · 04-23-2011, 04:56 PM

NYC water is straight from the Catskills and is nearly rainwater. Excellent brewing water stock. Its always easier to add ions than take out, so this water makes brewing easier.

Since AJ and I disagree on this point, I'll mention that having the capability to add alkalinity is an important tool you'll need to produce good darker beers. The dark grain grist and elevated percentage of crystal malts will tend to push the mash pH too low. My experience is that allowing the mash pH to drop below 5.3 can introduce an excessive level of sharpness and tartness in the flavor profile. In some styles, that is welcome. In others, its not.

**ajdelange** · 04-23-2011, 05:00 PM

I don't really disagree about the need to add alkalinity. I just hold that it is relatively rare that it needs to be done. I think the decision to add alkalinity to low ion content water should be ruled, in the first instance, by what your pH meter tells you and ultimately by what you palate tells you.

**Airborneguy** · 04-23-2011, 05:47 PM

The consensus among everyone I know is to add gypsum and a little table salt, depending on the style. I don't know much about water chemistry beyond the fact that NYC water is a great base for brewing almost every beer. Can either of you go into more detail about what I can do to make it even better?

**ajdelange** · 04-23-2011, 06:03 PM

I can go on for hours but after 20 years of doing so have decided that this is not the best approach for bringing beginners up to speed. Thus at the request of the administrators here I put up the Primer which is in the Stickies section of this topic. The idea is to start off KISS so you can be making good beer right away. The idea is not to discourage you from learning as much as you can from more detailed sources as you go.

The problem with the other sources is that the subject is quite intricate if not complex and there are a lot of sources that will give you archaic and sometimes flat out bad advice. Many if those sources are focused on emulating, for example, the water profile of Burton when you wish to make a Burton style ale. Better Burton style ales can be made without emulation of Burton's water (and the Brewers at Burton would have done this if they had the technology available to them that you have available to you).

There is still residue in the HB community that the color of a beer determines the "required" residual alkalinity if the water. Spreadsheets based on this thesis will have you adding tablespoonsful of chalk to your water or mash. If you have been making good dark beers following the Primer and find another source that recommends doing this this hope is that you would recognize that as suspicious and forbear from following that advice. Or if you do follow it and have been brewing from the Primer you should only make that mistake once. OTOH if you find a source that says add a little chalk for very dark beers you should reason that this isn't too extreme a departure from what you know works quite well and give it a try to see if it improves your beer.

**Airborneguy** · 04-23-2011, 08:25 PM

I'm going to read your primer when I get a chance. I've never delved much into water chemistry, because as I said, NYC water seems to be fine right out of the tap without much adjustment. Our water is also consistent through the seasons.

Now I increasingly find myself wanting to perfect certain styles though, so I will have to learn more about it soon.

BoxofRain · 04-23-2011, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airborneguy

NYC water seems to be fine right out of the tap without much adjustment. Our water is also consistent through the seasons.
.

There's a reason why our Pizza and Bagels are superior.

mabrungard · 04-23-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Airborneguy

The consensus among everyone I know is to add gypsum and a little table salt, depending on the style. I don't know much about water chemistry beyond the fact that NYC water is a great base for brewing almost every beer. Can either of you go into more detail about what I can do to make it even better?

The bottom line is 'less is better'. Don't go to extremes using published water profiles. As AJ said, it may not necessarily produce a better beer. Bru'n Water has a set of color-based water profiles that can be used as starting points for water adjustments. They were purposely formulated under the 'less is more' philosophy with minimal ion content that should be 'generally' good for that color beer. Bru'n Water goes further in giving the brewer the ability to further assess the effect of the grist on mash pH. You may need to adjust acid or alkaline additions predicted for those color-based profiles based on the grist-based pH prediction.

Its better than nothing, but as AJ says, first hand knowledge from a pH meter is the best guide. Bru'n Water has a pretty good ability to get you close, but pH measurement is the best guide.