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Old 10-29-2010, 01:19 AM   #1
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Default First RO Water additions

Im going to do a Boddingtons clone and want to add some things to my RO water to try to help things along. I found the EZ calculator excel spreadsheet and played around with some things. I was going to do for a 5 gal batch:
6 grams of Gypsum
3 grams of Calc Chloride
4 grams of Epsom Salt
3 gramd of Non-Iodized Salt
2 Oz *1.7% of grain weight of Sauermalz

Chloride to Sulfate Ratio is .67 and Mash PH of 5.22

I have no experience with this and would like some direction. Thoughts?

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Old 10-29-2010, 02:25 AM   #2
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That's alot of "stuff". What do those additions do to your calcium level and other levels? You're adding quite a bit of chloride and sulfate.

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Old 10-29-2010, 04:18 AM   #3
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I've had great success just going with these =

http://brewery.org/library/wchmprimer.html
These recipes are general-purpose "idealized" formulas for creating water from distilled for all-grain brewing. Refer to the above text for ideas for extract brewers. These recipes are for five gallons of ion-free water; scale up or down as needed. They are definitely "ballpark" profiles and can be adjusted liberally as desired. I'll "leave it as an excercise to the reader" to verify the resulting ppm concentrations.

When chalk is called for, you'll have to get it dissolved either by bubbling CO2 through the water (which works but takes time), or you can stir the proper amount directly into the mash, and let the mash's acidity dissolve the chalk. By "proper amount" I'm referring to a proportion matching the actual strike water used rather than the full five gallons on which these recipes are based. If you strike with 14 quarts, mix 70% of the amount shown (14 qt out of five gallons) directly into the mash. When sparging, stir the chalk directly into the sparge water, then acidify your sparge water to your favorite pH (5.7 is typical). This should help dissolve it (to incorporate the desired concentration of calcium) while neutralizing the detrimental effects of the alkaline carbonate by lowering the pH. Remember that we're trying to emulate the makeup of the water naturally found in regions where these beers are brewed; whatever the local brewer would do to those "natural waters", we should do too.

As of this writing, I have had success with the Burton profile given here but have not personally tried the others. These recipes are based on published profiles; I make no claims as to their suitability other than that the recipes should yield the indicated ion concentrations.

Burton Pale Ale -- A toned-down, "idealized" profile. Enough sulphate to bring out the hops without overdoing it. Low alkalinity helps ensure proper mash pH. Model: Moshers 'Ideal Pale Ale". 1 gram baking soda, 1 gram canning salt, 3.5 grams Epsom salt, 9 grams gypsum. Ca=111, SO4=337, Mg=18, Na=35, Cl=32, CO3=38, Hardness=352, Alkalinity=31.

English Ale -- More or less a London water profile. Model: A. J. deLange's "Ale" from HBD1965. 2 grams Epsom salt, 2 grams chalk, 0.3 gram canning salt, 0.8 gram gypsum. Ca=52, SO4=65, Mg=10, Na=6.2, Cl=9.6, CO3=63, Hardness=173, Alkalinity=106.

Light Lager -- Very small amounts of ions; just enough to acidify the mash. Model: Mosher's "Ideal Pale Lager". 1 gram Epsom Salt, 0.5 grams baking soda, 1 gram chalk, 0.5 grams canning salt. Ca=21, SO4=21, Mg=5.2, Na=18, Cl=16, CO3=51, Hardness=74, Alkalinity=69.

Medium Lager -- Malty, amber lagers like Oktoberfest. Loosely based on Papazian's Munich. 1 gram Epsom salt, 3.5 grams chalk, 0.5 grams canning salt. Ca=74, SO4=21, Mg=5.2, Na=10, Cl=16, CO3=111, Hardness=207, Alkalinity=185.

Dark Lagers -- Bocks, for example. Model: Mosher's "Ideal Mild Ale / Dark Lager". 2.5 grams Epsom salt, 2 grams chalk, 2.5 grams canning salt, 2.5 grams gypsum. Ca=73, SO4=125, Mg=13, Na=52, Cl=80, CO3=63, Hardness=236, Alkalinity=106.

Ken Schwartz,
KennyEddy@aol.com

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Old 10-29-2010, 10:42 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yooper_Brew View Post
That's alot of "stuff". What do those additions do to your calcium level and other levels? You're adding quite a bit of chloride and sulfate.
Looks close to what Quickie Water Chemistry Primer (below) says for a Burton Pale Ale except for my CI being higher.

Calcium Magnesium Sodium Chloride Sulfate
(Ca ppm) (Mg ppm) (Na ppm) (Cl ppm) (SO4 ppm)
105 18 57 157 236

You think these look OK?
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Old 10-29-2010, 10:43 AM   #5
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Thanks samc! Great reference! I hate the idea of chalk and I might try it latter down the road but it sounds like something to be avoided....

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Old 10-30-2010, 03:41 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bixter1 View Post
Im going to do a Boddingtons clone and want to add some things to my RO water to try to help things along. I found the EZ calculator excel spreadsheet and played around with some things. I was going to do for a 5 gal batch:
6 grams of Gypsum
3 grams of Calc Chloride
4 grams of Epsom Salt
3 gramd of Non-Iodized Salt
2 Oz *1.7% of grain weight of Sauermalz

Chloride to Sulfate Ratio is .67 and Mash PH of 5.22

I have no experience with this and would like some direction. Thoughts?
I do a lot of special bitters. I start with tap water (which in my case is soft although not quite as soft as RO water).
I add about 10 - 11 g of gypsum and calcium chloride for a 5gallon batch. (i.e 6g gypsum + 5g CaCl2).
For hoppy beers, I increase the gypsum and reduce the CaCl2. For malty beers, I increase the CaCl2 and reduce the gypsum.
I don't add Epsom Salts, Non-Iodized Salt or Sauermalz (which I can't get locally).
I need gypsum and/or CaCl2 to lower the mash pH, and to provide enough Ca.
I see no purpose in adding salt which doesn't affect the pH, adds Na (which I don't want), and increases the Cl concentration (which can also be achieved by increasing the CaCl2 addition).
I also see no purpose in adding Epsom Salts which have minimal effects on the pH, and increase the SO4 concentration (which can also be achieved by increasing the gypsum addition). According to George Fix, malt contains adequate Mg to make any Mg additions unnecessary.

-a.
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Old 10-30-2010, 11:58 AM   #7
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With this my PH should be around 5.3. seems good enough for me!! thanks!

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