Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Brew Science > Campden Tablets (Sulfites) and Brewing Water

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 01-10-2013, 02:39 AM   #11
ajdelange
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: McLean/Ogden, Virginia/Quebec
Posts: 5,844
Liked 568 Times on 468 Posts
Likes Given: 16

Default

In order to better answer questions about how much metabite to use for given levels of chloramine I have appended a table to the original post.

__________________
ajdelange is offline
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-10-2013, 09:28 PM   #12
DeltaRage
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 12
Likes Given: 1

Default

How long does the effect from the campden remain active in water? For example, if I dissolve half a campden tablet in a glass and then add a tiny amount from that glass to my starter to dissolve its chloramine, can I leave the rest of the water in the glass over night and then add it to my mash and sparge water when I brew the next day (or days) and still achieve the same effect? Or does the campden have to be used immediately after introducing it to the glass? Will campden-treated water get rid of cloramine from new water that I add in?

Thanks

__________________
DeltaRage is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-10-2013, 09:38 PM   #13
ajdelange
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: McLean/Ogden, Virginia/Quebec
Posts: 5,844
Liked 568 Times on 468 Posts
Likes Given: 16

Default

What's the first thing you notice when you play with Campden tablets? Your answer should be "I smell sulfur dioxide." Metabisulfite is often referred to as 'solid SO2' and it is indeed SO2 which destroys chloramine. The fact that you can smell the sulfur dioxide says that at least some of it is leaving the solution. Wait long enough and presumably enough of the SO2 will have escaped to render the solution less effective than when fresh. That said, it doesn't take much to do the job so that even if you let it stand overnight there may be enough SO2 left. Remember the simple test in the Sticky. If you can't smell chlorine then you have added enough SO2. It probably would be sensible to store unused solution in a tightly capped small jar. That will reduce the amount of SO2 which can get away.

__________________
ajdelange is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-10-2013, 10:13 PM   #14
BBL_Brewer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
BBL_Brewer's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Kokomo, IN
Posts: 3,697
Liked 423 Times on 294 Posts
Likes Given: 315

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajdelange View Post
What's the first thing you notice when you play with Campden tablets? Your answer should be "I smell sulfur dioxide." Metabisulfite is often referred to as 'solid SO2' and it is indeed SO2 which destroys chloramine. The fact that you can smell the sulfur dioxide says that at least some of it is leaving the solution. Wait long enough and presumably enough of the SO2 will have escaped to render the solution less effective than when fresh. That said, it doesn't take much to do the job so that even if you let it stand overnight there may be enough SO2 left. Remember the simple test in the Sticky. If you can't smell chlorine then you have added enough SO2. It probably would be sensible to store unused solution in a tightly capped small jar. That will reduce the amount of SO2 which can get away.
In which case storing with zero headspace would be ideal correct?
__________________
Slots Down Brewery
Stick with the plan....not the sparge.


Never Ending Liquid Yeast - How to Farm Yeast and Freeze it.

BBL_Brewer is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-11-2013, 04:31 AM   #15
ajdelange
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: McLean/Ogden, Virginia/Quebec
Posts: 5,844
Liked 568 Times on 468 Posts
Likes Given: 16

Default

Yes, indeed.

__________________
ajdelange is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-18-2013, 03:12 AM   #16
Spartan1979
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Spartan1979's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: O'Fallon, MO
Posts: 1,191
Liked 105 Times on 70 Posts
Likes Given: 92

Default

So, the way I read the original post, none of the metebisulfite remains in the water in that form, even if you have a low level of chloramines?

I know my water has chloramines, the water report tells me so, but I can't smell any. I use a half tab per 10 gallons. So I'm concerned that sulfites may remain in my beer and I know some people are sensitive to sulfites.

__________________
Spartan1979 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-18-2013, 02:56 PM   #17
ajdelange
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: McLean/Ogden, Virginia/Quebec
Posts: 5,844
Liked 568 Times on 468 Posts
Likes Given: 16

Default

I really don't think you need to be concerned. You are using 1/2 tablet per 10 gallons. Vintners use 1 tablet per gallon - 20 times this - and they don't dilute with sparge water or boil. If you are concerned about excess use the titration method described in the original post.

Potassium metabisulfite is 57.6 % SO2. If you added 300 mg/10 gal (300 mg/37.8L) i.e. about half a Campden tablet in 10 gal, that would be 4.57 mg SO2 per liter. After dilution with sparge water, boiling, absorbtion of oxygen, reduction of other compounds and formation of adducts with aldehydes and reduction to sulphide and CO2 scrubbing in the fermenter very little of this would make it through to the beer. Much more would be produced by other sources (sulfate in the water, sulfur containing amino acids in the malt). For untreated beer you can expect SO2 at from 1 - 16 mg/L and, in Britain, where sulfites are added to beers to stabilized them, the statutory limit is 40 mg/L.

__________________
ajdelange is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-19-2013, 12:58 PM   #18
Aschecte
Brewtus Maximus
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Aschecte's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Florida, NY
Posts: 1,692
Liked 65 Times on 61 Posts
Likes Given: 39

Default

I'm very curious about this... I already use campden to treat chloramine but is there a accepted time length. What I usually do is treat it the night befrore at 1/2 a tab per 10 gallons and it's pretty spot on. Do I really need to treat the night before or could I get away treating it 30 minutes before I start to brew ? Thanks for the advice.

__________________
Funky Onion Brewing est.2010
Primary-Turbid mashed Lambic
Primary-Flanders Red
Secondary-Burley whiner American barleywine
Primary-A dark German lager or a Hoppy Munich Helles
Aschecte is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-19-2013, 01:10 PM   #19
ajdelange
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: McLean/Ogden, Virginia/Quebec
Posts: 5,844
Liked 568 Times on 468 Posts
Likes Given: 16

Default

You could do it 30 seconds before you brew. The reaction is very fast but it does take some time for the metabite to dissolve. As people usually dose at a higher level than is really necessary (in terms of the actual chloramine level) this does not effect chloramine removal i.e. plenty dissolves to take care of the chloramine.

__________________
ajdelange is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-18-2013, 09:51 PM   #20
sloanfamilydsm
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Des Moines, IA
Posts: 229
Liked 71 Times on 24 Posts
Likes Given: 5

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBL_Brewer View Post
I use potassium metabisulfite powder when I'm not using RO water. I use it at a rate of 0.025 grams/gallon. Got that dose rate from a BYO article I think. Kind of hard to measure accurately for small batches though if you don't have a scale with a resolution better than + / - 0.1 grams.
+1

I've been using .022 per gallon, but close enough.
__________________
sloanfamilydsm is online now
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Do campden tablets de-chlorinate water King of Cascade All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 71 05-08-2013 08:53 PM
Campden tablets for beer brewing foxyaardvark Beginners Beer Brewing Forum 1 08-29-2012 12:14 AM
Anybody have chloramines in their water and not use campden tablets? phenry General Beer Discussion 15 06-29-2011 03:35 PM
Campden Tablets and Sulfites Gavagai Brew Science 4 01-03-2011 01:20 PM
campden tablets and its effect on base water levels martinworswick Brew Science 5 01-07-2010 11:06 PM