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Old 03-15-2013, 07:23 PM   #591
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I have one big question though... I've heard that reverse osmosis typically reduces the concentrations of dissolved solids by 90% (ie - water that goes into the RO system with 100ppm of Ca comes out with around 10ppm).
It should be more like 2 - 5 ppm i.e. you should be getting rejections of over 95% and 98% or even a little more for some ions in a properly functioning system.

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If that is true then I probably will still have problems even using straight RO water judging by my Ward Labs report:
Probably not. This water is very high in sulfate and highish in sodium but is otherwise pretty normal.


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Needless to say, water heaters don't last long in these here parts...
?

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So, given the mineral content of my water to begin with, would I be better off just using straight RO, or should I still toss in a few grams of calcium chloride?
If you do use RO then you will definitely want to add calcium chloride and acid (for most beers) and sulfate for those in which you want the hop character associated with sulfate.
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Old 03-15-2013, 07:33 PM   #592
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It should be more like 2 - 5 ppm i.e. you should be getting rejections of over 95% and 98% or even a little more for some ions in a properly functioning system.
Okay. I'll definitely take your word for it over the nebulous "they". Would using a TDS meter be a good way to evaluate how effective the RO system is?

Also, any word yet on when your book is coming out? I think back in June of last year you said it might be another year... is that still on track?


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?
Scale will build up in water heaters to such an extent that the lower element will burn out if the tank isn't drained every year or so.


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If you do use RO then you will definitely want to add calcium chloride and acid (for most beers) and sulfate for those in which you want the hop character associated with sulfate.
Check. I'll definitely be using RO for this next batch, and I have all the other supplies necessary to do the adjustments (including a pH meter and calibration solutions). I probably should brew the same recipe I've already done before to make this a more scientific test, but where's the fun in that?

Thanks for the reply - the effort you have expended in this thread alone should surely qualify as legendary.
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Old 03-15-2013, 08:12 PM   #593
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Would using a TDS meter be a good way to evaluate how effective the RO system is?
Yes, definitely.

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Also, any word yet on when your book is coming out? I think back in June of last year you said it might be another year... is that still on track?
It's not my book - I'm just doing tech editing on it. The authors are finding out what I knew already - this isn't an easy subject to write a book on. I have no idea what the publisher will actually want to do but I'd say that it still needs quite a bit of work. My guess is that, as was the case last year, the hope would be to get it out for the NHA conference. I don't see making that schedule without cutting some corners but it is possible.




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Scale will build up in water heaters to such an extent that the lower element will burn out if the tank isn't drained every year or so.
Figured that might be it but the water isn't that bad as almost half is permanent hardensss (does not deposit).
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Old 03-15-2013, 08:20 PM   #594
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Anyone have any thoughts on this?

pH 9.3
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) Est, ppm 720
Electrical Conductivity, mmho/cm 1.20
Cations / Anions, me/L 11.3 / 12.2

Sodium, Na 205
Potassium, K 8
Calcium, Ca 22
Magnesium, Mg 13
Total Hardness, CaCO3 109
Nitrate, NO3-N 0.5 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S 121
Chloride, Cl 91
Carbonate, CO3 20
Bicarbonate, HCO3 85
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 104
Fluoride, F 1.05
Total Iron, Fe 0.05

This is local tap water (sourced from ground water).

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Old 03-15-2013, 09:12 PM   #595
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I'm afraid there isn't much you can do here. The sodium level is pretty high and the sulfate level is even beyond the EPA's SMCL. Unless you are willing to restrict yourself to a very limited range of beer styles you will have to run this water through an RO system or obtain water from another source.

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Old 03-15-2013, 11:27 PM   #596
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That is what I came up with besides maybe blending with RO. But a second is very much appreciated. Thanks AJ!

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Old 03-27-2013, 08:08 AM   #597
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I'm doing a dunkel weissbier with 3.9% black patent malt(carafa special 3). Should I skip the sauermalz altogether or just reduce it a little? I assume I treat it as a soft water beer otherwise(with CaCl)?

thanks

L
Just doughed in. Used 50g sauermalz. Not as dark as porter but dark anyway

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Old 04-05-2013, 11:22 PM   #598
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Anyone have any thoughts on this?

pH 9.3
Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) Est, ppm 720
Electrical Conductivity, mmho/cm 1.20
Cations / Anions, me/L 11.3 / 12.2

Sodium, Na 205
Potassium, K 8
Calcium, Ca 22
Magnesium, Mg 13
Total Hardness, CaCO3 109
Nitrate, NO3-N 0.5 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S 121
Chloride, Cl 91
Carbonate, CO3 20
Bicarbonate, HCO3 85
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 104
Fluoride, F 1.05
Total Iron, Fe 0.05

This is local tap water (sourced from ground water).
I thought it was a sample from the Portal to hell they just discovered in Turkey! that's some rough agua you have. Imperial Dortmunder?
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Old 04-05-2013, 11:33 PM   #599
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I've done nearly 50 batches now using the E-Z Water Calc spreadsheet. There has been a very good correlation between predicted mash pH and measured. I admit to being impressed at how powerful NaHCO3 is in raising mash pH inthe mash. For instance, a 24.5 lb mash came in with a pH at 4.92. Adding only 2 gm of NaHCO3 brought it to 5.25. This has been consistent. Post boil pH has been within targets and the beers are turining out well.

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Old 04-06-2013, 02:26 AM   #600
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I thought it was a sample from the Portal to hell they just discovered in Turkey! that's some rough agua you have. Imperial Dortmunder?
Maybe, lol. All that sulfate has a very mild laxative effect, so all the visitors usually feel better after they leave...
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