Get your HBT Growlers, Shirts and Membership before the Rush!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Lambic & Wild Brewing > Very Wild Saison ECY20
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-06-2011, 02:27 PM   #1
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default Very Wild Saison ECY20

Well I brewed up my recipe of a spelt saison this past Friday. I had planned on ending up with 8 gal of wort at 1.052ish gravity. I instead ended up with just over 6 gal of wort at that gravity. I had a brew pump mishap due to not having the fittings I ordered and tried to brew in a jury rigged manner with my new pump. That was a bad idea.

Anyhow after I cooled my wort down and ran it off into two separate 5 gal fermentors with about 3 gal each I had a thought. Each fermentor will give me roughly a case after loss to trub and such. One fermentor got my ECY03 washed yeast from the last saison I made with rye. The other fermentor is now fermenting with ECY20. I decided that I would use part of the culture in this low gravity 3 gal batch with out using a starter of any kind. I figure in three months or so both fermentors will be done with the ECY20 showing some nice sourness.

I sort of came up with my own mash regime for brett fermenations after reading Wild Brews, Farmhouse Ales, and Brew Like a Monk. When using 30% flaked adjunct I infuse 2qts/lb for a 120F protein rest, then sacch rest temp is acheived through a wort only decoction bringing the mash up to 147-149 for 1.5-2hrs. After the sacch rest I pull off another wort only decoction and raise the mash temp up to 158-160 to dextrinize the remainder of any sugar possibly left. After that has settled I start running the mash off with no mash out step and vorlauf to clear it up for about 2-3 gal worth. I heat my sparge water to 185-190 because the measured temp at the end of my sparge hose is about 170-175 after temp loss along the way. The conversion enzymes get denatured in the kettle. This mashing method has given me good fermentable worts that allows the Saccharomyces yeast to take the wort down to about 1.010. Then over 2-3 months the brett has takes it down rest of the way. This mash takes inspiration from BLAM mentioning that Orval has no mash out step. Then the "rising infusion mash" mentioned in Farmhouse Ales that Saison DuPont uses. Finally the wort only decoctions take inspiration from the body building german techniques along with the dextrinous mashing techniques outlined in Wild Brews for lambics. I think it gives a nice balance of quick fermenation for the Sacch yeasts and food for the slower Bretts. This is my first time using this mash for a mixed culture containing bacteria though. So we shall see how long it takes.

I have been on a mission to create a very tasty rustic saison. I figured between using 30% spelt, 25ish ibus of low AA hops, and now a very mixed culture will get me as close as I'll come to historic saisons. Depending on how the ECY20 batch progresses I will brew up another batch this time as a full 8 gal recipe getting the ECY20 so I can have some nicely tart saison to go through the summer.

__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
fivepoundpossum Likes This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-07-2011, 04:11 AM   #2
statseeker
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 476
Liked 15 Times on 13 Posts
Likes Given: 2

Default

Sounds good. Do you run off how ever many gallons of wort and heat it up then run it back through the mashing process again to achieve the proper mash temp step up? I'm hoping the US-04 in my brown (mashed at 155) leaves enough sugar behind for the brett. I've had a lot of times using 04 or 05 where they get the mash down to .018 or so but never seem to get it drier than that. But with the bigger pitches I've been doing, it's done a better job drying out the beer and not leaving much behind. My 3724/wild yeast saison got down so far that it left nothing for the brett C. No further drop in gravity. No sugar left = no brett character. I might try using a decoction mash for my next bretted beer. I should probably get Wild Brews to gleen more info. But I'm hoping to get there with time on my own.

__________________

For new brewers, especially new all-grain brewers: Check out my blog The New Brewer Chronicals: brewerchronicals.blogspot.com

statseeker is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-07-2011, 11:43 AM   #3
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

I use beersmith and the decoction calculation will say (based on mash volumes) to decoct 2 gal of wort to raise the mash temp from 120F to 148F. That's just an example but I'll just run the wort into a small 4 gal pot. I measure with a pitcher. Then when it gets to boiling I add it back to the mash to bring the main mash temp up. This denatures some enzymes along the way but not enough to prevent conversion. I only really do this for brett beers and maybe when I use 3711 again I'll use it for that.

__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-08-2011, 11:23 AM   #4
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

The krausen on this fermentation is pretty crazy looking. The half that used ECY03 is down all the way and just minor surface bubbles. The ECY20 fermentor has a good 4" worth of giant bubbles hanging out on top.

I can't wait to brew up my big flanders brown on Saturday to use the ECY20 strain.

__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-09-2011, 12:45 AM   #5
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default



There it is so far. Yeast pitched at the same time. The ECY03 carboy has no krausen anymore. The ECY20 is on the right. I will update with deflated pellicle pics as this progresses.
__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2011, 12:59 PM   #6
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

I did a gravity check this morning. The ECY03 is already down to 1.003. So that will be going in bottles very soon. The ECY20 is only at 1.010 and is in a sick period. It poured out like maple syrup. So the gravity is likely lower but the viscosity of the beer is throwing off the gravity reading. I will obviously have to wait a few months till the brett chews up the ropiness from the pedio to bottle the ECY20 portion. ECY03 has a very weak dusty pellicle and the ECY20 doesn't have any pellicle to speak of at this point. In fact this was the first I did anything with either beer since I stuck them in the fermentors.

__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2011, 01:10 PM   #7
Native302
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Milton, Delaware
Posts: 696
Liked 7 Times on 7 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

I got my ecy yeasts in yesterday and Can't wait to use them. Bug country, flemish ale, newark ale, saison brassiere

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by bottlebomber

Just buy a small swimming pool, throw everything in and mash it. Then open ferment in another swimming pool with all the yeast.
Native302 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2011, 03:09 PM   #8
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

I hope I can get my hands on some of the Flemish Ale blend. I have all the grains necessary for a flanders red. I figure I'll brew that around Jan/Feb.

__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2011, 11:37 PM   #9
Native302
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Milton, Delaware
Posts: 696
Liked 7 Times on 7 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

This will be my first flanders. Is there a recipe or grain bill you could recommend to me?

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by bottlebomber

Just buy a small swimming pool, throw everything in and mash it. Then open ferment in another swimming pool with all the yeast.
Native302 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-03-2011, 12:04 AM   #10
smokinghole
Senior Member
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
smokinghole's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lucid Dream Land
Posts: 2,916
Liked 122 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 12

Default

Here's what I'm doing. It's based on what I have on hand and instead of yellow maize I'm using purple maize. The mash will be a split mash with the corn and 10% of the base malt. Hold that at mash temp for a bit then raise to a boil for 20-30 min. Add to main mash that is at protein rest temp of about 122. The corn mash should raise the main mash up to a decent sacch rest temp.


Type: All Grain Date: 7/4/2011
Batch Size (fermenter): 6.00 gal Brewer: Adam Cole
Boil Size: 7.86 gal Asst Brewer:
Boil Time: 60 min Equipment: Brew Pot (10 gal) and Cooler (52 qt)
End of Boil Volume 6.76 gal Brewhouse Efficiency: 80.00 %
Final Bottling Volume: 6.00 gal Est Mash Efficiency 86.7 %
Fermentation: My Aging Profile Taste Rating(out of 50): 35.0
Taste Notes:
Ingredients


Ingredients
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
6 lbs Vienna Malt (Franco Belges) (3.5 SRM) Grain 1 48.0 %
2 lbs 8.0 oz Purple Maize (30.0 SRM) Grain 2 20.0 %
1 lbs Aromatic Malt (26.0 SRM) Grain 4 8.0 %
12.0 oz Carared (20.0 SRM) Grain 6 6.0 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Caravienne Malt (22.0 SRM) Grain 3 12.0 %
12.0 oz Caramunich Malt (45.0 SRM) Grain 5 6.0 %
2.00 oz Strisslespalt [2.50 %] - Boil 90.0 min Hop 7 15.8 IBUs
1.0 pkg Flemish Ale (East Coast Yeast #ECY02) [50.00 ml] Yeast 8 -

Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.058 SG Measured Original Gravity: 1.010 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.006 SG Measured Final Gravity: 1.005 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 6.9 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 0.6 %
Bitterness: 15.8 IBUs Calories: 32.0 kcal/12oz
Est Color: 15.9 SRM

__________________

Going through life is hard.
Going through life stupid is harder.

smokinghole is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wild yeast from "wild" grapes DrJerryrigger Lambic & Wild Brewing 11 10-15-2011 01:52 AM
First Wild Brew El_Exorcisto Lambic & Wild Brewing 23 12-30-2010 10:04 PM
Question about a Wild IPA ace3's carboy Lambic & Wild Brewing 3 10-31-2009 09:18 PM
Wild Brewing Day B-Dub Lambic & Wild Brewing 0 07-21-2009 05:34 AM
FG of Wild brews Jsta Porter Lambic & Wild Brewing 5 02-10-2009 05:57 PM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS