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Old 03-08-2013, 11:56 PM   #11
othellomcbane
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RP15 is a "killer yeast", it will suppress and eventually kill brewer's yeast. now the amount of RP15 contained in the dregs of one bottle is pretty low so your sacc should get a good head-start before the RP15 can make the brew too toxic.

this would be an interesting thing to look into: when (and if) the sacc is killed off? there is a chance the sacc is killed before it finishes, and the RP15 won't touch the maltose, thus leaving more for the bugs. or maybe the RP15 doesn't have time to take hold before the army of sacc takes over.

i've read that making a starter out of sour dregs is a bad idea because it disturbs the balance of the bugs. some need oxygen to grow, others can't live in the presence of too much oxygen - thus a starter will favor some bugs over the others. best to just pitch them as they are.
Will it kill Brett, or just Sacc?
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Old 03-09-2013, 06:51 AM   #12
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Will it kill Brett, or just Sacc?
Just sacch. Any "killer" wine strain will eliminate any sacch and most wild yeasts within a couple days. Part of why champagne yeast is such a nice bottling yeast. Brett, of course, is some sort of hybrid of cockroaches and the villains from all the Terminator sequels; it can survive acid, high ABV, killer yeast and lurk in scratched plastic until it's ready to rise up and destroy your beer.

Vinnie Cilurzo said most neighboring winemakers would refuse to visit Russian River out of fear that they would unwittingly carry Brett back to their wineries. Supposedly, if you get Brett into your winery, it's essentially impossible to get it back out without pursuing a scorched earth policy. Nice to know that we can just use bleach on the homebrew level.
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Old 03-11-2013, 01:36 AM   #13
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Any "killer" wine strain will eliminate any sacch and most wild yeasts within a couple days. Part of why champagne yeast is such a nice bottling yeast.
slightly OT, but i've wondered about how desirable this characteristic is. on the one hand, killing wild yeast is indeed a good thing. on the other, i wonder if you want sacc to stick around during conditioning/aging (vs. champagne only). dunno.

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Vinnie Cilurzo said most neighboring winemakers would refuse to visit Russian River out of fear that they would unwittingly carry Brett back to their wineries. Supposedly, if you get Brett into your winery, it's essentially impossible to get it back out without pursuing a scorched earth policy. Nice to know that we can just use bleach on the homebrew level.
and i'm pretty sure that vinnie followed that up with "... and their fears are completely over-stated." i've read & heard several times that brett is no harder to kill than sacc or any other microorganism. the problem is that if you don't do a good job with brett, the consequences are worse: a little brett can have a big effect (hyper-attenuation is a really bad thing when not expected). a little stray sacc isn't a big deal - by the time it can regroup and try to spread, the main pitch will have taken over and gotten the job done. whereas a few wayward brett cells...
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