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Old 09-23-2010, 01:01 PM   #1
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Default Sour Blonde mash pH question

I'm going to take a shot at brewing a Sour Blonde. The grain bill I'm using has 13% Acidulated Malt, 12% Flaked Corn and Belgian Pilsner for the rest. Should I add most of the Acidulated Malt at the end of the mash so that the Corn and Pilsner can convert at an appropriate pH at the beginning? If I put it all in at the beginning, I estimate a mash pH of 4.8-4.9.

And what extract potential does Weyermann Acidulated Malt have? They don't list it on their website.

Thanks,
Nate

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Old 09-23-2010, 03:36 PM   #2
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Sounds like a good plan, maybe 45 without it and another 45 with it? It is hard to say what sort of extract you’ll get because after you add it the pH might be too low for good conversion. Ideally it should be close to pils with good enzyme action, since that is esentially what it is (pils with a lacto coating).

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Old 09-23-2010, 03:48 PM   #3
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Their Acidulated Malt has a moisture content of 7% compared to 4.5% for a recent sack of their Pilsner. So, I'm going to assume slightly less extract, especially since some of it may not get converted.

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Drinking: Tropicale Thunder v2, Lambic, Brett Trois IPA, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde, RIS v1 & v2, Barleywine
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Old 09-24-2010, 12:47 PM   #4
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How long do you plan to mash for?

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Old 09-24-2010, 12:58 PM   #5
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I'm going to add 5% acidulated at first, which should get the pH around 5.3 since it's such a light colored beer (3.1 SRM). Let that rest until conversion is complete (30-60mins) and then throw in the other 8.5% Acidulated and see how the gravity and pH reacts over the next 15-30 mins. If conversion is still happening with the whole 13.5% dose of acidulated malt in there, I'll let it keep going. It's going to be an intensive refractometer and pH meter mash, haha.

Here's the recipe if anyone's curious:

Sour Blonde
Date: 9/26/10
Batch Size: 7.00 gal
Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 89.60%

Ingredients
8.50 lb Dingemans Pilsner (1.8 SRM) Grain 66.05 %
1.55 lb Briess Flaked Yellow Corn (0.8 SRM) Grain 12.04 %
1.42 lb Weyermann Acidulated Malt (2.3 SRM) Grain 11.03 %
0.75 lb Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 5.83 %
0.65 lb Briess Carapils (1.5 SRM) Grain 5.05 %
0.85 oz Sterling [6.00 %] (60 min) Hops 16.3 IBU
0.97 oz Sterling [6.00 %] (30 min) Hops 9.5 IBU
0.97 oz Sterling [6.00 %] (0 min) Hops -
1.00 items Servomyces (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs Brettanomyces B. (White Labs #WLP650) Yeast-Ale
1 Pkgs Whitbread Ale (Wyeast Labs #1099) Yeast-Ale

Beer Profile
Original Gravity: 1.0575 SG
Est Final Gravity: ?
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: at least 5.4% ABV
Bitterness: 25.8 IBU
Est Color: 3.3 SRM

Mash Profile
Single rest with mash out
60 min Sacc Rest Add 4.02 gal of water at 170.9 F 160.0 F, ad6ed only .6 lbs Acidulated Malt
15 min Sacc Rest after adding remaining .82 lbs Acidulated Malt
15 min Mash out Heat to 170.0 F over 5 min 170.0 F

Notes
9/22 - 2L starter of Wyeast 1099 with a production date of 9/8/10. Starter finished and taken off stir plate after 24 hrs to put a 2 liter starter on for the Brett B with a best by date of 9/30/10. Brett starter took 3 days to finish.

Pitched 1099 @ 65F, set controller for 75F
Crash cool when finished, transfer off 1099 and add Brett.
See what happens.

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Fermenting: Conan DIPA, 1830's English Mild @ Earth - Bread + Brewery, Dopplebock, Cider, Rye Berliner Weisse, Barrel Fermented Dreg Lambic, Brett Trois Helles, Sauerkraut Fermented Gose, Carrot Blossom Cedar Mead
Drinking: Tropicale Thunder v2, Lambic, Brett Trois IPA, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde, RIS v1 & v2, Barleywine
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Last edited by dstar26t; 09-28-2010 at 11:21 AM. Reason: updated recipe
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Old 09-27-2010, 11:34 PM   #6
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Brew day went well. I adjusted the recipe down to only 11% acidulated after trying Ithaca's Brute again. Tried to turn down the sour just slightly to appeal to a broader crowd. Put 4.6% acidulated in to start and hit a pH of 5.2. After conversion, added the rest and hit 4.75 pH. After 15mins, the rest of the acidulated had converted. Should have added rice hulls because it took forever to lauter. I'll post back in a year to tell you all how it tastes

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Drinking: Tropicale Thunder v2, Lambic, Brett Trois IPA, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde, RIS v1 & v2, Barleywine
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Old 09-28-2010, 02:23 AM   #7
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If I were you, I would skip the Brett, and trek out to Princeton Homebrew in Trenton. There is a culture of bugs that you can only get there (aside from Al B directly) that should compliment this beer much more than the Brett... I know because I have damn near the same beer with Al's bugs that is 10 months old. Best sour I have ever made in my life.

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Old 09-28-2010, 11:08 AM   #8
dstar26t
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Is it a mixture of Brett strains or is there pedio and lacto in there too?

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Drinking: Tropicale Thunder v2, Lambic, Brett Trois IPA, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde, RIS v1 & v2, Barleywine
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Old 09-28-2010, 12:40 PM   #9
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All of the above, plus some kombrucha, sherry and sacch strains

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Old 09-30-2010, 02:49 PM   #10
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Just an update, last night I crash cooled this recipe. FG was 1.021. I didn't let it go higher than 75F during fermentation. Picking up some of Al B's bugfarm batch #4 on Saturday and pitching it after transferring off the Whitbread yeast. Then wait.

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Next: Oktoberfest v5
Fermenting: Conan DIPA, 1830's English Mild @ Earth - Bread + Brewery, Dopplebock, Cider, Rye Berliner Weisse, Barrel Fermented Dreg Lambic, Brett Trois Helles, Sauerkraut Fermented Gose, Carrot Blossom Cedar Mead
Drinking: Tropicale Thunder v2, Lambic, Brett Trois IPA, Brett Blonde, Kriek, Saison, Sour Blonde, RIS v1 & v2, Barleywine
Barrel aged: RIS, Rye Barleywine, Tripel

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