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Old 01-21-2010, 03:58 PM   #11
wetherel
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I've got a 9 sours I have been aging on the lees for 3-15 months. Most of them have little or no saccharomyces, except for two of them. The two that I did primary fermentation with saccharomyces have a rubbery aroma (I think it's autolysis from the saccharomyces yeast bed), that Brett has yet to remove. I'm going to rack these two off, and hope the Brett will eventually clean it up. In the future I'm going rack any sours which use saccharomyces as a sole primary yeast. I don't have any scientific evidence though; maybe the rubbery aroma is from something else.

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Old 01-21-2010, 04:11 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Tonedef131 View Post
That's true for acetic acid, but I find pitching the blend right at the beginning will increase the total lactic acid in the finished product because it give the lacto a chance to work before the alcohol gets too high for it. If you pitch the blend after sacc has taken the beer to 5% abv or so the lacto won't be able to do much and then you are depending solely on the pedio for lactic sourness.

But as for total sourness more O2 will give you more acetic acid, less hops will give you more lactic acid and adding a tart fruit like pie cherries can balance the sourness with malic acid.
Thanks. Direct pitching is something that I plan to try for my next attempt. I actually used Lambic Blend II instead of Roselare simply because it wasn't available at the time. Due to the barrel aging for a year, it was plenty sour but I can't say my pallette knows the difference between lactic and acetic just yet.
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Old 01-21-2010, 06:00 PM   #13
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I can't say my pallette knows the difference between lactic and acetic just yet.
It's easiest to equate each once with a food, so when you taste that sourness and it reminds you of something you are familiar with you can recognize it.

Acetic acid: Vinegar
Lactic acid: buttermilk and yogurt
Citric acid: lemons and limes
Malic acid: Pomegranate and tart apples
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Old 01-24-2010, 09:54 PM   #14
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racked it off the yeast today. hated to disturb the buggies. How long does it take for the pellical to form typical?

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Old 01-24-2010, 10:01 PM   #15
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I think it took about a month for mine to develop, pipapat.

Here was mine after a month or so, it turns a lot more white later on.

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Old 01-24-2010, 11:54 PM   #16
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good too know thanks for the response.
I had a little going when i racked it today.
but it was not covered like i see in many pictures.

I plan on doing 2 more batches with my tax return and getting 2 more carboys.

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Old 01-25-2010, 06:33 PM   #17
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I left mine on the yeast, now going on 6 months. I took a sample a week or so ago and had no autolysis flavors that I could detect. This thread is making me think about racking it though... I just don't want to "infect" another better bottle, and I don't have any more glass carboys to put it in, so I guess I'd have to suck it up one way or another... Choices...

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Old 01-25-2010, 11:38 PM   #18
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I left mine on the yeast, now going on 6 months. I took a sample a week or so ago and had no autolysis flavors that I could detect. This thread is making me think about racking it though... I just don't want to "infect" another better bottle, and I don't have any more glass carboys to put it in, so I guess I'd have to suck it up one way or another... Choices...
glass carboys are not cheap but worth having.

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Old 02-28-2012, 07:14 AM   #19
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Hello, I have been considering making an extract+grains Flanders Red and would like comments and suggestions on what I have come up with during my research.

4.0 lbs Munich Extract (LME)
3.3 lbs Briess Pilsen (LME)
0.5 lbs Special B
0.5 lbs caramunich
0.5 lbs aromatic malt
1 tsp. Irish Moss (15 mins)
.075-1oz Hallertau Pellets
Wyeast Roselare Blend

I was going to steep the grains at 155F for 20-30 mins
Add extracts
Boil Time: 2 Hours
Hallertau hops with 60 mins left
Irish Moss with 15 mins left
Pitch yeast per directions

3 weeks in primary
Age 6 months in secondary with oak chips, read that using a plastic fermenter works well.
Add some form of sour dark cherry and age addition 2 months.
At this point I would start to bottle maybe 1-2 gallons at a time looking to age the remaining beer longer.

Comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

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