Happy HolidaySs Giveaway - Last Sponsor Giveaway of the Year!

Come Enter the BrewDeals/FastFerment Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Lambic & Wild Brewing > First Sour Brew - Racking to Secondary
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 10-17-2010, 05:24 PM   #1
sherm1016
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Milwaukee
Posts: 9
Default First Sour Brew - Racking to Secondary

My first sour brew has been in the primary fermentor for about a month now, and I was planning on racking it today. Three questions:

1. It looks like the pellicle is starting to form. Any concerns about racking it now? I am assuming it will just reform over time in the secondary.

2. I was going to add 1 oz of medium toast oak cubes. Do I need to sterilize them (vodka perhaps), or should I just drop them in the secondary before I rack.

3. What size carboy should I use for the secondary? I have a 5 gal or a 6.5 gal at my disposal. Does the amount of headspace in the secondary make a difference?

Thanks in advance.

__________________
sherm1016 is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-17-2010, 10:11 PM   #2
dwarven_stout
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Boise, ID
Posts: 1,629
Liked 34 Times on 32 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Don't rack it to secondary.

You'll get more complexity and a better beer if you just leave it alone. Each successive generation of microorganism will feed on the generations preceding. If you rack it, you'll lose a lot of bug food.

If you want to add oak, you can either soak the cubes in vodka like you mention, or you can pop them in the microwave for a couple minutes with some water. That's what I usually do and it seems to work out.

__________________

"I can't believe how many people think Air Lock is pronounced Hydrometer." -BigKahuna
"If you gave me a beer with placenta in it without telling me I would kick you in the nuts." -ODaniel
"We be in a big hurry for dope beer with much alcamahol and flavor, quality, balance, and aroma don't matter. We just wantz to be druck, u know?" -Yooper

dwarven_stout is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-18-2010, 02:02 PM   #3
Oldsock
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Oldsock's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: DC, Washington DC
Posts: 3,112
Liked 187 Times on 127 Posts
Likes Given: 114

Default

I like racking my sours, I like the "cleaner" (for lack of a better word) flavor for everything but my lambics (which I do leave in primary). It's a personal taste issue, almost all of the sours produced in America and Belgium (besides the lambic family) are transferred off the primary yeast before long term aging.

Agreed on steaming/microwaving the oak, I like to remove some of the those fresh "lumber" flavors before aging my beer on them for months/years.

I'd go with the smallest carboy that can hold the beer. Make sure to keep the airlock topped up, I've tasted numerous homebrewed sours that went to vinegar and/or nail polish remover as a result of a dry airlock.

Good luck!

__________________

Check out The Mad Fermentationist for my adventures in fermentation and my book: American Sour Beers!

Oldsock is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-18-2010, 02:51 PM   #4
dwarven_stout
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Boise, ID
Posts: 1,629
Liked 34 Times on 32 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Mm. I definitely prefer the extra funk.

I'm still working on getting a puckering sour like RR though... I don't know how those guys do it.

__________________

"I can't believe how many people think Air Lock is pronounced Hydrometer." -BigKahuna
"If you gave me a beer with placenta in it without telling me I would kick you in the nuts." -ODaniel
"We be in a big hurry for dope beer with much alcamahol and flavor, quality, balance, and aroma don't matter. We just wantz to be druck, u know?" -Yooper

dwarven_stout is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-18-2010, 03:08 PM   #5
Oldsock
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Oldsock's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: DC, Washington DC
Posts: 3,112
Liked 187 Times on 127 Posts
Likes Given: 114

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwarven_stout View Post
I'm still working on getting a puckering sour like RR though... I don't know how those guys do it.
They actually do a clean primary fermentation, transfer off the sediment, and pitch Brett going into the barrel. After the Brett has some time (weeks-months) to get established they do a large Pedio/Lacto pitch. I think a lot of it is having the right bugs tht can tolerate the alcohol/hops (the commercial cultures are a bit too easy to kill). Barrel aging seems to help as well (although i'm not entirely sure if its the oxygen, or the wood), the barrels we have get as sour or more sour than my carboy fermented beers despite the clean primary fermentation.

Beatification is sour mashed before being spontaneously fermented, talk about a sour result.

I've noticed that racking doesn't reduce the production of sourness, just the complex farmyard/barnyard Brett funk. It still shows up, but racking lets me taste more of the malt/funk/wood etc... rather than having a dominant "rustic" character.
__________________

Check out The Mad Fermentationist for my adventures in fermentation and my book: American Sour Beers!

Oldsock is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 10-19-2010, 02:59 AM   #6
dwarven_stout
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Boise, ID
Posts: 1,629
Liked 34 Times on 32 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldsock View Post
They actually do a clean primary fermentation, transfer off the sediment, and pitch Brett going into the barrel. After the Brett has some time (weeks-months) to get established they do a large Pedio/Lacto pitch. I think a lot of it is having the right bugs tht can tolerate the alcohol/hops (the commercial cultures are a bit too easy to kill). Barrel aging seems to help as well (although i'm not entirely sure if its the oxygen, or the wood), the barrels we have get as sour or more sour than my carboy fermented beers despite the clean primary fermentation.

Beatification is sour mashed before being spontaneously fermented, talk about a sour result.

I've noticed that racking doesn't reduce the production of sourness, just the complex farmyard/barnyard Brett funk. It still shows up, but racking lets me taste more of the malt/funk/wood etc... rather than having a dominant "rustic" character.
Yeah, I haven't had a chance to do a barrel sour yet. Club just finished a scotch ale barrel project, so a few of us are trying to get a flanders going in there. Failing that, I have a friend of a friend that can get $20 barrels, so we might just get our own and start it growing.
__________________

"I can't believe how many people think Air Lock is pronounced Hydrometer." -BigKahuna
"If you gave me a beer with placenta in it without telling me I would kick you in the nuts." -ODaniel
"We be in a big hurry for dope beer with much alcamahol and flavor, quality, balance, and aroma don't matter. We just wantz to be druck, u know?" -Yooper

dwarven_stout is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wanted: Sour beer lovers to taste a sour mash beer OldRalHoleBrewing Lambic & Wild Brewing 12 09-03-2012 05:16 AM
first sour zackmon21 Lambic & Wild Brewing 3 07-19-2010 03:28 PM
My Red isn't sour chase Lambic & Wild Brewing 26 07-10-2010 06:21 AM
Always sour mash for sour brews? jvlpdillon Lambic & Wild Brewing 4 04-27-2010 11:21 PM
first sour brew tommorrow!!! Ton Lambic & Wild Brewing 6 02-22-2009 05:43 AM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS