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Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Lambic & Wild Brewing > A few questions on a Flanders Red
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Old 05-02-2011, 02:44 AM   #1
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Default A few questions on a Flanders Red

Working on a recipe for a Flanders red right now my buddy and i are going to brew up in a few weeks.

Based off of a few recipes i have seen and wild brews.

OG 1.052
IBU: 12ish

Vienna 50%
Munich 15%
Caramunich 7%
Maize/white wheat 10%
Special B 3%

Hallertauer to get to correct ibu's


Thought i would ask people with some experience if it looks good, i probably could of just gone pound for pound from someone else's recipe but what the hell, might as well do something different haha. We are going to brew up 15 gallons of this and secondary it in a sanke keg in my parents "cellar" (partially underground garage closet that stays pretty consistent temps lol). Primary we are thinking of fermenting in 3 carboys, 2 pitched with us-05 and the 3rd pitched directly with roselare.
opinions? thoughts? concerns? criticism? haha

thanks!
-Josh

edit: also planning on adding some oak cubes to it that i have been saving all my bottle dregs in.

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Old 05-02-2011, 02:10 PM   #2
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Sounds like you've got the right plan. I like the idea of doing two primaries with US05 and one with roeselare. I've never liked the recipes that pitch roeselare from the get-go because they always turn out far to sour in my opinion. I typically ferment in primary with US-05 until it's about 80% done, then I'll pitch brett, pedio, and lacto in seperate strains.

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Old 05-02-2011, 03:24 PM   #3
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I've had the opposite experience, I've never been able to get much sourness without pitching the bugs up front. That concern is doubled with US-05 since it is such an attenuative strain.

The recipe looks fine to me, although honestly the details of a recipe aren’t nearly as important with a sour beer as most other styles since so much of the character is from the lactic acid bacteria and Brett.

Good luck.

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Old 05-02-2011, 03:43 PM   #4
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I think there are two camps on this one. You either mash near 160F so that the wort is too dextrinous to have the US05 completely ferment out or you pitch all strains up front. Beer yeast usually works too quickly to try timing the addition of souring bugs IMHO. What does "too sour" mean?

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Old 05-02-2011, 06:35 PM   #5
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This has been one of my concerns as well. I am personally a fan of a more sour beer compared to one that is less. But the main reason we are only pitching directly into one is our lack of carboys we want to make permanent for sours. I know some people use carboys for both and have no problems but we decided to play it safe. I forgot to mention i plan on mashing high on this one. Last time i did this i mashed around 157 and luckily had it stall out around 1.02 before i added the bugs. I plan on doing the same on these ones and hope the combo of a higher OG and 1/3rd of it being pitched directly will result in something that is sour enough but not overly sour. Thanks for the replies guys.

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Old 05-02-2011, 09:55 PM   #6
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Can't say I have a ton of experience, I have brewed a lot of sours that still are aging. But based on other people's beers I've sampled, and the samples I have pulled from some of my sours - I am definately in the camp of people who say you don't get enough sourness when you pitch regular ale yeast first. I have an Oud Bruin that I did a 4 day primary with WLP001, then added WL Sour Mix for secondary. It's almost 3 months old, and still barely a hint of sourness. It is so common that I hear about undersoured beers, and very rare that I hear about oversoured beers. I say add them both at the same time, or be prepared to wait 3 years or more for a good level of sourness. And I would definately pay close attention to anything "Oldsock" says - check out his blog. He has probably brewed more sours than the rest of us combined.

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Old 05-02-2011, 11:04 PM   #7
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Yeah i get what your saying. I might rethink my process and see if can at least get 2 carboys that are directly pitched. Thanks for the advice man. oh and yeah i do read his blog, it is very helpful!

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Old 05-02-2011, 11:25 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M View Post
What does "too sour" mean?
I say if anyone thinks any beer is too sour, they should stick to Budweiser and leave the delicious Belgians for me!
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Old 05-03-2011, 01:18 AM   #9
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haha nice. So if i stick with my 2 carboys with us-05 and 1 with roselare. At what time should i transfer them all to the sanke keg. My original thought was to wait for us-05 ones to be done then combine them all. But then i was wondering how long most of you leave your directly pitched roselare beers in primary? obviously i know this varies but i guess more general guidelines are what im looking for. I dont want to take the roselare off its yeast cake to soon. Im thinking i should just wait until they have all pretty much slowed down but thought i would ask. I hope that jumble of terribly worded sentences made sense lol.

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Old 05-03-2011, 02:23 AM   #10
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This is just a theory, but with your 3 carboy scenario, I think what would be good would be to first brew up just enough wort to fill your 2 "clean" carboys and pitch the neutral yeast. A few days later, brew up the rest of the wort that you would have added to the 3rd carboy, and add that plus the 2 you already have going to the sanke and pitch the Roselare into the whole batch. This way there is some fresh wort in there that hasn't been fermented by your neutral yeast already for the bugs to feast on, and you won't lose any Roselare goodness in a transfer. Like you, I would want to keep the beer on the cake once the Roselare is in there. I worry that if I transfer the beer, I will lose some of the souring bugs from the cake. Makes sense to me. Maybe someone else will chime in here and say I'm wrong, but the more I think about this, the more I like the sound of it.

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