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Old 09-30-2013, 11:48 PM   #1
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Default Brettanomyces in St. Bretta and Hopsavant

I am trying to culture dregs from bottles of St. Bretta and Hopsavant. Do they use different Brett strains for these two beers? Any input would be very helpful.
Thanks guys!

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Old 10-01-2013, 12:20 AM   #2
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I believe those two are CMY01 only. I don't have a a source to show you, just going off what my friend who's a Cellar Reserve member and slightly obsessed with CS in general has told me.

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Old 10-01-2013, 04:18 AM   #3
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I just used brett from hop savant in a 100% brett batch, so Im curious myself. If it really is just one strain, I would be very impressed that so much brett character is coming from just a single strain. Its very aromatic, surprisingly tart and attenuated over 90%. My experience with brett trois as the primary yeast has been very different in all aspects.

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Old 10-05-2013, 04:02 AM   #4
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I recently cultured dregs from both beers (Spring St. Bretta and Hop Savant from around then too). Started with 250mL 1.030 wort for about ~8 days and stepped up to 2L with 1.040 wort for another ~8 days for both. I don't know if they have the same brett strains, but they did have noticeably different fermentations pitching into ~6 gal each.

I brewed the St. Bretta version a few months ago. It had a vigorous start and had noticeable activity for about a month then visually no signs. I split that into separate three gallon carboys after around 5-6 weeks (1/2 on 10 lbs apricots!). What I sampled was nicely soured already and impressibly drinkable for such a short time. Similar flavor profile of the St. Bretta (I used a similar recipe to what he has published), but definitely much more sour. Was down to 1.006 from 1.052, so nearly 90%. Dropped relatively clear.

The Hop Savant dregs had a very lengthy and slow fermentation with tight white bubble and 1/2" head consistantly streaming for almost two months. It was filled all the way to the neck so the 1/2" isn't that much volume. Still a bit cloudy. Both beers fermented in the low 70s.

Still haven't tried that one, but I do suspect it will be very sour especially after tasting the decanted beer from the starter. Although he labels his bottles "100% Brett" I think there is definitely lacto in these beers. Pretty sure stepping up the dregs shifted the ratios more towards the lacto for mine.

Recently finished a 100% brett IPA with trois and there is very little acidity, tropical fruit (mainly hops), but pretty clean over all and hard to really distinguish the brett at this point - especially with so much hop character right now. A little over 80% attenuation on that one. That one's around 6 weeks old and been on tap for 2. Just my recent experience.

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Old 10-16-2013, 02:42 PM   #5
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I just opened a bottle of my 100% brett pale ale last night. This beer is quite tart, to the point where I would suspect there is lacto in the beer if I hadnt made it myself. Either there is a very hearty strain of lacto in there that wasnt inhibited by the IBU's in this beer, or the brett is producing creating some very tart flavors. It doesnt seem to taste like lactic acid to me, but I can tell its not acetic acid for sure.

Im glad I have 5 gal of this in bottles. Very interesting and delicious beer. Tangy, fruity sourness with a lot of mosaic and galaxy character. The oats I used provide enough body to give some mouthfeel to this dry beer.

Building up the brett from hop savant was worth the time. Ill have to keep this culture around for a while. Currently waiting to see how it acts as a secondary fermenter in my biere de garde.

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Old 10-16-2013, 04:40 PM   #6
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Several brett strains make acids other than acetic beyond the flavor threshold. Kinda kills the 'brett won't make sour beer argument.'

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Old 10-21-2013, 01:46 PM   #7
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Several brett strains make acids other than acetic beyond the flavor threshold. Kinda kills the 'brett won't make sour beer argument.'
Which strains and acids? Any actual studies shown that? I've certainly brewed some tart beers with Brett alone, but nothing that I feel fits the acidity of a true "sour" beer.
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Old 10-21-2013, 04:22 PM   #8
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Which strains and acids? Any actual studies shown that? I've certainly brewed some tart beers with Brett alone, but nothing that I feel fits the acidity of a true "sour" beer.
I don't know of any studies so purely anectdoatal. CMY01 seems to make tart beer, that tastes more lactic than acetic. The bug county lamebic i have going is a citrus bomb (which I've heard from others also) and Al says that one or more of the strains in there makes citrus acid. ECY03B starter, albeit from a stir plate, was very pleasantly acidic and not acetic, though it didn't seem particulalry citric either. A friend with a lab is checking out the WLP 645 beer I made that was very lactic. I'm looking forward to seeing if he finds the same blend of brett, pichia, and lacto CY did.

I'm not a big fan of the term 'sour beer', although I did use it in my original post. I don't really like sour anything, I prefer tart. Maybe that's just sour grapes.
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Old 10-21-2013, 08:12 PM   #9
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I don't know of any studies so purely anectdoatal. CMY01 seems to make tart beer, that tastes more lactic than acetic. The bug county lamebic i have going is a citrus bomb (which I've heard from others also) and Al says that one or more of the strains in there makes citrus acid. ECY03B starter, albeit from a stir plate, was very pleasantly acidic and not acetic, though it didn't seem particulalry citric either. A friend with a lab is checking out the WLP 645 beer I made that was very lactic. I'm looking forward to seeing if he finds the same blend of brett, pichia, and lacto CY did.

I'm not a big fan of the term 'sour beer', although I did use it in my original post. I don't really like sour anything, I prefer tart. Maybe that's just sour grapes.
CMY would be CHads personal collection?
Finnaly grabbed the Stbretta and was interested on the strain he used?
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Old 10-21-2013, 09:43 PM   #10
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CMY would be CHads personal collection?
Finnaly grabbed the Stbretta and was interested on the strain he used?
He's got a bunch. CMY01 is one he developed, I want to say originally isolated from 3F, but not sure about that. Many of his beers have multiple brett strains or bugs as well, but a few of them, including St Brett IIRC, are CMY01 only.
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