Happy HolidaySs Giveaway - Last Sponsor Giveaway of the Year!

Come Enter the BrewDeals/FastFerment Giveaway!


Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Recipes/Ingredients > Southern Tier Pumking Clone??
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 09-21-2011, 10:45 PM   #141
pacifisticuffs
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 12
Likes Given: 1

Default

I also reached out to a brewer at Southern Tier for some guidance. I showed him the recipe from the first post in this thread and linked to it in case he was curious to read more, and here's his reply:

Quote:
Unfortunately, The Pumking is one of those beers where they don't like us to give too much away recipe-wise. Really, I suppose all I can recommend targeting a high mash temperature (156F-158F) so there will be some more residual sugars after fermentation. Maybe a little more magnum to get 30 IBUs. But beyond that, the owner really doesn't like us discussing the recipe, sorry.
Major bummer they have to be so tight lipped, but it's understandable given the demand for this.
__________________
pacifisticuffs is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-22-2011, 02:53 AM   #142
NJstout
Registered User
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: fairfield, nj
Posts: 239
Liked 8 Times on 4 Posts

Default

Quote:
Unfortunately, The Pumking is one of those beers where they don't like us to give too much away recipe-wise.
I find southern tier to be this way about all there recipes
__________________
NJstout is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-24-2011, 09:40 PM   #143
HYGBrewin
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Hockessin, Delaware
Posts: 44
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannondale View Post
For this years' pumpkin ale I decided to try to clone ST Pumking. I did a side-by-side last and it is very difficult to tell it from the genuine article. The intense aroma, unique graham cracker/raw pumpkin flavour, and spicing are all there. Recipe is based on label/ST website, various forums and my own speculation and tweaking when racking to secondary. I think the keys are the lactose and the ginger/vanilla. I really wasn't expecting that I would closely replicate the unique flavour profile of pumking, so I am both surprised and very pleased with the outcome.

Vol: 5.5 gal
Kettle Vol: 7 gal
OG: 1.090
IBU: appx. 34
SRM: appx. 11

Fermentables:
14 lbs. 2-Row Pale malt
1 lb. Victory
12 oz. Crystal 80°L
1 large Pumpkin (skinned, cubed and roasted with honey then added to mash)
1 lb. Demerara sugar (added after hot break)

Hops:
3/4 oz. Magnum @ 60 min.
1/4 oz. Saaz @ 15 min.

Additives:
8 oz. Lactose @ 15 min.
1/2 tsp. Yeast nutrient @ 10 min.
1 Whirlfloc tab @ 10 min.
2 tbsp. chopped Candied Ginger @ 5 min.
2 Cinnamon sticks @ 5 min.
1/2 tsp. Cloves @ 5 min.
1.2 tsp. grated Nutmeg @ 5 min.
1/2 tsp. Allspice @ 5 min.
1 Vanilla Bean (added to secondary)
1/2 tsp. ground Cinnamon (added to secondary)

Yeast:
2 packs Safale US-05

Mashed @ 152°F for 90 min.

Boiled for 60 min.

Fermented @ 66°F RT for 2 weeks in primary and 3 weeks in secondary. Force carbonated in keg.

Notes: The lactose could possibly be increased from 8 oz. to 10 oz., but definitely no more than that. Excluding the allspice and nutmeg might nudge it even closer to an exact clone, but it is not critical. I think that they key elements are the victory malt, lactose, vanilla and ginger.
Video from my brew day making this recipe back on the 3rd... Just transferred to secondary today. Came out at an even 8% ABV. Couldn't find vanilla beans anywhere, but went to one of our gourmet grocery stores in the area and found a bangin bourbon vanilla bean extract that I added a tablespoon and a half of - bottle said 1TBS = 1 Bean. Now for it to sit another 2 weeks

__________________
http://www.largemargebrewing.com
Home of the Large Marge 9000 Brew Stand, Recipes, Brewing Videos, tasting reviews, and more.
HYGBrewin is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 03:18 PM   #144
beerfold
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 8
Default

Last year I tasted and smelled hazelnut in the aroma. It didn't seem as strong to me in the bottle I had this year, but I still get a hint of it. Hazelnut is not unheard of in pumpkin pie or beer. I don't know that ST uses it, but maybe a bit of hazelnut extract at bottling would help with this cloning effort.

__________________
beerfold is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 03:26 PM   #145
Bonesey
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Toronto
Posts: 14
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerfold View Post
Last year I tasted and smelled hazelnut in the aroma. It didn't seem as strong to me in the bottle I had this year, but I still get a hint of it. Hazelnut is not unheard of in pumpkin pie or beer. I don't know that ST uses it, but maybe a bit of hazelnut extract at bottling would help with this cloning effort.
I would guess the nutty aroma is from the grains. The use of HZ extract would have to be used judiciously; something like 1/4 oz for a 5 gal batch as to not dominate the other spice aromas. You don't want to end up with a Rogue hazelnut brown clone.
__________________
Bonesey is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 03:44 PM   #146
KingBrianI
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 3,490
Liked 82 Times on 58 Posts
Likes Given: 9

Default

Does anyone else get tons of "cap'n crunch" aroma and flavor from this beer? After having a pumpking and a creme brulee stout for the first time last week, I've realized there is no way to get those kinds of flavors in beer without resorting to artificial measures. That's why I think there is a lot of truth in the following quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodovico View Post
So I actually spoke with someone at ST last night. He didn't give me specifics but told me that they use an alcohol based spice mixture of Cinnamon, Nutmeg, and cloves. He told me that he's heard of people having success on a smaller scale making a tincture using 151 and their spices. He said it's all added after it ferments out.

I know he's not telling me the WHOLE story because there is certainly vanilla in this beer. But cool that he shared some information.
The "alcohol based mixture" the employee referred to is most likely an artificial "spice" extract. Probably something like this http://spicebarn.com/pumpkin_spice_flavoring.htm. I bet the reason there were differing stories from the owner and the employee is that the owner is reluctant to admit to using the flavorant while the employee had less reason to be reserved.
__________________

I'm too lazy and have too many beers going to keep updating this!

KingBrianI is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 03:51 PM   #147
KingBrianI
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 3,490
Liked 82 Times on 58 Posts
Likes Given: 9

Default

In fact, looking at the other flavorants on the site I linked to above, they have a "vanilla butter and nut" that may be used as well and give the pumpking the crust flavor everyone talks about and I refered to as cap'n crunch. It's probably where the hazelnut aroma some people get comes from too.

There is also a "burnt sugar" flavorant on there. Creme Brulee Stout?

I think if anyone wants to really clone this beer, you've gotta use the artificial flavors.

__________________

I'm too lazy and have too many beers going to keep updating this!

KingBrianI is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 04:00 PM   #148
passedpawn
Waste Allocation Load Lifter - Earth Class
HBT_MODERATOR.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
passedpawn's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: ☼ Clearwater, FL ☼
Posts: 19,618
Liked 3600 Times on 2221 Posts
Likes Given: 3105

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBrianI View Post
In fact, looking at the other flavorants on the site I linked to above, they have a "vanilla butter and nut" that may be used as well and give the pumpking the crust flavor everyone talks about and I refered to as cap'n crunch. It's probably where the hazelnut aroma some people get comes from too.

There is also a "burnt sugar" flavorant on there. Creme Brulee Stout?

I think if anyone wants to really clone this beer, you've gotta use the artificial flavors.
You are probably right. I have tried several times with discrete spices, and I keep missing the target.
__________________
Hey goomba I love how you dance the rumba
But take some advice paisano learn-a how to mambo
If you're gonna be a square you ain't-a gonna go anywhere.
passedpawn is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 10:48 PM   #149
SpanishCastleAle
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 4,384
Liked 29 Times on 29 Posts

Default

Something about the numbers on the bottle don't seem to add up. The ST website says the ABV is 8.6%. There is a picture of the label that says 9% ABV and 19* Plato. 19* Plato is ~1.079 and in order to get even 8.6% ABV from that you'd need to hit a FG of ~1.013 (~84% apparent attenuation). Pumpking doesn't taste that highly attenuated so I don't get it. Unless they actually do add lactose but don't include it in the OG.

__________________
Early brewers were primarily women, mostly because it was deemed a woman's job. Mesopotamian men, of some 3,800 years ago, were obviously complete assclowns and had yet to realize the pleasure of brewing beer.- Beer Advocate
SpanishCastleAle is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 09-27-2011, 11:07 PM   #150
jessup
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: asheville, nc
Posts: 596
Liked 6 Times on 6 Posts
Likes Given: 3

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBrianI View Post
I think if anyone wants to really clone this beer, you've gotta use the artificial flavors.
thank you. if you go back a years worth of time you'll see my rant about using graham cracker extract. it's not the same as the flavorants you've mentioned, but i feel there's def some common ground there with the "enhancement" of flavors.
__________________

set I: Pale (3) -> Mild (4-5) -> amber / Victory (20-25) -> special roast (40-50) -> brown (70)
set II: pilsner (2) -> Vienna (3-4) -> Munich (8-10) -> dark Munich (20) -> aromatic / melanoiden (25-30)
encore: smoked (5)

jessup is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Southern Tier Creme Brule stout Clone jmilton1987 Recipes/Ingredients 73 08-21-2014 01:29 PM
Anyone know of a Southern Tier - Pale Recipe Clone? bmckee56 Recipes/Ingredients 12 03-29-2012 11:11 PM
Help with Southern Tier Heavy Weizen Clone fluxgame Recipes/Ingredients 8 06-21-2011 04:57 PM
Southern Tier Pumking jwible204 Recipes/Ingredients 19 10-11-2010 11:51 PM
Anyone up for a clone project?? -Southern Tier Choklat- Lodovico Recipes/Ingredients 0 11-23-2009 08:07 PM



Newest Threads

LATEST SPONSOR DEALS