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Old 03-04-2011, 07:07 PM   #1
jmll89
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Default saison recipe help

i'd like to brew a 5 gallon batch of saison for the spring/summer months, and have combined a some different pieces from different recipes i've seen - especially the kill devil saison. here's what i've got (forgive the excessive detail - it helps as a newbie)

4.5 gal boil steeping .5 lb briess caramel 20L to 170 degrees
extract: 2.5 lb wheat DME and 6 lb Pils LME

90 minute boil
Hops: .5 oz Magnum @ 90 min
1 oz hallertauer @ 15 min
1 oz hallertauer @ 0 min - steep for 15 minutes, then stir in the honey and let cool

yeast: Wyeast French Saison W3711
2 weeks primary, 2-4 weeks secondary
OG: 1.055ish FG: 1.005ish

any suggestions?
should i make a starter for the yeast?

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Old 03-04-2011, 07:45 PM   #2
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Perhaps other people will describe other experiences, but I was never able to get 91% attenuation from extract with either 3711 or 3724. The recipe looks like the right kind of profile, but I suspect your yeast will stall out significantly before you hit 1.005. You mention honey in the directions, but not in the ingredients. Simple sugars will help your attenuation, but I still doubt you'll get down to 1.005.

Yeast pitching rates and careful temperature control will be critical. Unless you are willing to pitch multiple packets of 3711, I strongly suspect that you will need to make a starter, but Mr. Malty will tell you for sure.

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Old 03-04-2011, 07:54 PM   #3
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Well, that's an opinion thing. I've seen people say that 3711 is a beast and will handle it considering the OG is about were Wyeast recommends the limit. Mr. Malty will say to have a starter. In addition, there are other benefits to starters such as making sure yeast are viable and healthy.

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Old 03-04-2011, 08:07 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Berock View Post
Well, that's an opinion thing. I've seen people say that 3711 is a beast and will handle it considering the OG is about were Wyeast recommends the limit. Mr. Malty will say to have a starter. In addition, there are other benefits to starters such as making sure yeast are viable and healty.
Huh? Of course it is an opinion, but it is one based on experience. Have you made an extract beer that attenuated to 91% with 3711? I'd be happy to hear evidence otherwise, but predictions about a beer not yet made are necessarily going to be speculative. FWIW, Wyeast says that standard attenuation for this yeast is 77-83%.

Out of curiosity, where are you finding recommended limits on OG from Wyeast? I've never seen that before. Plus, saisons bigger than 1.055 aren't all that uncommon.
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Old 03-04-2011, 08:14 PM   #5
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First, I meant "Well, that's an opinion thing" to the OP not to your post. It was in response to the questions "should i make a starter for the yeast?". Second, it recommends a smack pack used for OG of 1.034 to 1.060. http://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_productd...m?ProductID=16. Its under the usage section.

I've used the smack pack without a starter several times with no issues but if you have time, its probably a good idea to use a starter.

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Old 03-04-2011, 08:20 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Berock View Post
First, I meant "Well, that's an opinion thing" to the OP not to your post. It was in response to the questions "should i make a starter for the yeast?". Second, it recommends a smack pack used for OG of 1.034 to 1.060. http://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_productd...m?ProductID=16. Its under the usage section.

I've used the smack pack without a starter several times with no issues but if you have time, its probably a good idea to use a starter.
Ah, gotcha...opinion about starter. That's certainly true. Considering that this recipe is going to be pushing attenuation limits, though, the OP should probably do everything possible to help his poor yeast along.
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