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Old 10-28-2008, 05:56 AM   #1
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Default Porters and Stouts: Soy Sauce Flavor

Okay, I'm drinking Breckenridge's Oatmeal Stout, and it's not bad, but not amazing, and I'm noticing this odd flavor. It's sorta roasty, but somewhat like soy sauce. I've tasted it before in porters, and I'm trying to figure out what causes it. Would it be considered an off-flavor, or is it from a particular grain, or what? It's really strange.

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Old 10-28-2008, 09:41 AM   #2
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I have not had that particular beer so I am not sure. I would imagine that the flavor you are tasting is inherent in one of the dark roasted grains. Possibly Black Patent malt. Either way the robust porters that I have had are pretty smokey tasting.

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Old 10-28-2008, 09:59 AM   #3
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No idea. I've gotten that flavor in young stouts/porters when made with extract. Maybe oxidation? I've had that particular beer before and I can't recall that flavor, but it has been probably about a year since I've had one, so maybe I just forgot. I think their vanilla porter is much better than the oatmeal stout.

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Old 10-28-2008, 12:27 PM   #4
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Yeah, I think I remember the soy sauce taste with Samual Smith's Taddy Porter, but I haven't had that beer in years. The Breckenridge Vanilla Porter is great, btw.

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Old 10-28-2008, 12:59 PM   #5
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The last few times I had the Breckenridge Oatmeal Stout, I noticed a faint sour note near the finish that accentuated that soy flavor.

I've generally suspected that flavor was a combination of the dark grains, dark caramel malts, ph, some oxidation, ect. There is an interesting thread over on ratebeer that offered a suggestion that glutamate (a byproduct of yeast fermentation and primary source of the savory flavor of soy sauce) could be present in higher levels of the beers that have that soy sauce note. Glutamic acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia I'd be curious to see more info or know if there was any stock in the whole umami concept applied to these beers....

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Old 10-28-2008, 04:20 PM   #6
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What temperature is the beer?

I tend to taste a soy sauce flavor in stouts and porters when they are cold straight out of the fridge. By sheer luck, my friends and I were blessed by the great brewers of Terrapin with around 20 cases of their India Brown Ale (underfilled bottles that couldn't be sold). I'm the only one that drinks it now. They all call it the soy sauce beer.

Let one warm up on the counter for 10-15 minutes and see if you taste the same thing.

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Old 10-29-2008, 05:29 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edcculus View Post
What temperature is the beer?

I tend to taste a soy sauce flavor in stouts and porters when they are cold straight out of the fridge. By sheer luck, my friends and I were blessed by the great brewers of Terrapin with around 20 cases of their India Brown Ale (underfilled bottles that couldn't be sold). I'm the only one that drinks it now. They all call it the soy sauce beer.

Let one warm up on the counter for 10-15 minutes and see if you taste the same thing.
Yes, they have been right out of the fridge. I'll try that idea tonight after work.
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Old 10-29-2008, 05:49 PM   #8
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A guy a while ago was asking about this. If you look on the beer wheel, meaty flavors are supposedly tied to yeast. I concur with brewtool assertion that it is linked to glutamic acid. Umami is not a myth, it is a fact. Some people are just way more sensitive to it. If you like foods like tomatoes, mushrooms and seaweed you like Umami. It is possibly the combination of flavors, along with other factors allowing you to perceive the glutamic acid. That would be my guess, well that and you are probably fairly sensitive to it.

You could do an experiment. Buy a small amount of msg from an Oriental grocer. Take a few grains and add it to a beer and then see if you get the same perception.

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Old 10-29-2008, 07:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Umami is not a myth, it is a fact
Sorry, science says otherwise.
SpringerLink - Journal Article
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Old 10-29-2008, 07:23 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phissionkorps View Post
Sorry, science says otherwise.
SpringerLink - Journal Article

Meh...Who listens to Jerry Springer anyway?

I think there's too much evidence in support of the taste being perceived...I mean it's been discussed for 100 years after all...

as a cook I can really appreciate being able to bring it forth in a dish I produce...it doesn't happen in all my dishes, but I know when I manage to nail it...

I would have love to have been here;

UMAMI Information Center - New Frontiers of Taste Umami Symposium

This is cool....http://www.umamiinfo.com/images/stor...ent_report.pdf

This is from the panel discussion notes on the pdf.

Quote:
Human milk is actually very high in glutamate. So the breastfed infant is getting an experience that is very different from that of a formula‐fed infant. The other issue I thought was extremely interesting is the persistence and mouth feel that umami gives, which is quite different from that of the other 4 basic tastes in that there is almost a tactile sense. And writers in the 1950’s and 1940’s in the U.S. always
honed in on the fact that not only does umami have taste and a chicken‐y sort of flavor, but that it gives body and depth to food.
There is no question that finding the receptors for glutamate on the tongue, beginning around 1999, has clarified the fact that this really is something that is profoundly important, but I still think we don’t quite understand all the ramifications of those discoveries.
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