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Revvy 07-27-2008 03:59 PM

Piraat "Belgium Tripel IPA" Clone Help...Arrgh!
 
Yesterday I tried Piraat Tripel IPA (My tasting notes are here; http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showpost...3&postcount=11)

I'd really like to do a clone of this....using teh googelz netted me several contradictory recipes for it, including a couple from here...

I'm wondering has anyone actually brewed a clone of it?
Has anyone brewed any of these recipes?

Here's the ones I've found...Starting with the 2 from here.

Quote:

17 Lb's Belgian Pilsner malt, 1/2 lb. crystal 20 L., 4 oz. Cara-Vienna, 4 oz. Aromatic. 1 Lb. Belgian light candi sugar, 1 oz. Brewers Gold @ 5 AAU (60 min), 1 oz. Styrian Golding with 1/2 tsp.Crushed Coriander(15 min.) 1/2 oz. Styrian Golding with 1/2 tsp.Crushed Coriander @ 1 tsp Sweet orange peel (10 min), White Labs WLP500 Trappist Yeast, Prime with 1-1/4 Cup wheat DME.

Best mashed @ 152 Degrees for appoxx. 90 min. Depending on your efficiency you should have a 10/10-1/2 Alcolhol."
Quote:

11 lbs. Plain Extra-Light DME
1˝ lbs. Belgian Clear Candi Sugar
8 oz. Crystal Malt 20°L
4 oz. Belgian Cara-Vienne Malt
4 oz. Belgian Aromatic Malt
1 oz. Brewers Gold 60 minutes
1 oz. Styrian Goldings 15 minutes
˝ oz. Styrian Goldings 5 minutes
˝ tsp. ground coriander 15 minutes
˝ tsp. ground coriander 5 minutes
1 tsp. Sweet orange peel 5 minutes
1 tsp. Irish moss 15 minutes
1 pkg. Wyeast 3787 Trappist high gravity yeast

Steep specialty grains for 30 minutes @ 150°F.
Keep fermentation around 68-70°F.
Prime with 1˝ cup wheat DME.
The finished volume is: 6 gallons
Technical file for Piraat 9%:
9 % alcohol by volume, 18.5° Plato
Amber colored beer with secondary fermentation in the bottle or in the keg.
Shelf life: at least 2 years after bottling date.

OG: 1.096
FG: 1.024
SRM: ~11
IBU: 9
ABV: 9.3%
And 2 from beertools forum...

Quote:

5 lbs. German 2-row Pils
5 lbs. German Vienna info
.5 lbs. Weyermann CaraHellŽ i
.25 lbs. Belgian Aromatic
.25 lbs. Acidulated Malt
2 lbs. Corn Flaked
.25 lbs. Light Brown Sugar info
1 oz. Santiam (Pellets, 5.8 %AA) boiled 60 min. info
1 oz. Spalt Spalter (Pellets, 4.7 %AA) boiled 1 min. info
1/4 teaspoons Powdered irish Moss (not included in calculations)
Yeast : WYeast 3787 Trappist High Gravity

Single infusion mash at 145-149 until converted. COncoction to raise to 167 mash out. Mash out at 169 F through direct heat.
90 minute boil.
Dark brown sugar is Panela Piloncillo added at 60 minutes with hops.
1 g. powdered grains of paradise .
12 g. crushed Morrocan coriander at knock-out.
35 g. Vallencia Orange zest at knock out (~4 oranges).
7 g. powdered chamomile flowers.
2 quarts of water added at end of boil to bring volume up to 5.25 gal. 1 qt yeast starter added to bring up to 5.5 gal.
Quote:

14 lbs. Belgian Pils
.25 lbs. Acidulated Malt
1 lbs. Midwest Wheat Malt
1.5 lbs. Honey info
.75 lbs. Corn Flaked info
.5 oz. Cascade (Whole, 5.50 %AA) boiled 0 min.
2 oz. Liberty (Whole, 4.1 %AA) boiled 90 min.
1 oz. Cascade (Whole, 5.50 %AA) boiled 15 min.
1/2 ounces Corriander, ground (not included in calculations)
1 ounces Sweet Orange zest, fresh (not included in calculations)
Yeast : WYeast 3787 Trappist High Gravity

Spring water.
MASH: Dough-in with 1 gal. of water at room temp. Add 4 gal. @ 142 to raise and rest @ 122-127 for 15 min. Decoct 50% (~8 qt. wet grains + liquid to fill spaces) of mash to raise temp to 150-152 for 45 mins. Decoct 40% (~6 qt. wet grains + liquid to fill spaces) to raise temp to 168 for 10 minutes. Sparge with 5 gal. water at 168.
DECOCTIONS: Raise decoction to 160-162F for 20 minute rest. Then bring to boil for 10 minutes
BOIL: Boil for 90 mins. Add Orange Blossom honey at knock-out. Force cool with heat exchange/tap water.
Aerate for 60 minutes. Pitch yeast (2 punch-packs)@ 70 F.
Bottle prime with 4 oz. of dextrose boiled in 8 oz. water. Innoculate with 1 packet of Lalvin ec 1118 Champagne yeast to activate yeast.

1 tsp. powdered Irish Moss (2 g.) , 1 tsp yeast nutrients (3 g.), corriander for 15 minutes and orange peel for last 5 minutes of boil.
Ferment at 75F
Secondary at 65F for 7 days
Cold condition at 45 degrees for 2 weeks.
The first and last ones seem the most promising...at least they hit the ABV dead on...

I can't figure out where the distinctive apple-ness might come from..Is it from the WYeast 3787 Trappist High Gravity which 3 of them use?

Suggestions, Ideas, practical experience anyone?

ericd 07-27-2008 06:24 PM

I think this may be one of those instances where using your intuition and "following your heart" may be the way to go.

King of Cascade 07-27-2008 06:28 PM

Make all three and do a tasting

Revvy 07-30-2008 02:02 PM

I'm bumping this up since I posted it this weekend and didn't really get any help...Anyone? I'd like to maybe brew it this weekend....

Thanks!

Cugel 07-30-2008 05:13 PM

They have a recipe in the clone brews book. Your LHBS should have it.

ohiobrewtus 07-30-2008 05:17 PM

My guess is that the apple notes that you are referring to are going to come from the yeast and careful control of fermentation temperatures.

Glancing quickly at the recipes I would tend to start with the first one, but Belgian or not, that seems a bit low on hops to be referred to as an IPA.

Revvy 07-30-2008 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ohiobrewtus (Post 778375)
My guess is that the apple notes that you are referring to are going to come from the yeast and careful control of fermentation temperatures.

Glancing quickly at the recipes I would tend to start with the first one, but Belgian or not, that seems a bit low on hops to be referred to as an IPA.

That's the odd thing about Piraat and all of the Van Steenberge beers is their lack of hoppiness....They claim it's an IPA by history since it was brewed for sea voyages....

I can't find the IBU's anywhere, to see if any recipes are close...what would you suggest?

BJCP categorizes piraat as a Belgian Strong, and the IBU range is 22 – 35 so I guess if I were tweaking I'd aim for the higher end of the spectrum....

Edit Deep in google I found it listed on an old Seattle Beerfest listing as having 31 IBU's

niquejim 07-30-2008 06:12 PM

I have not had that beer so I can't really help, but I know someone who makes a Chouffe Houblin clone and says he's getting close. I don't know how close those 2 are but I can e-mail him for his recipe if you like

Revvy 07-30-2008 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cugel (Post 778371)
They have a recipe in the clone brews book. Your LHBS should have it.


Is it for Piraat or Gulden Draak? What I keep seeing online says the Draak is in clone brews....hmmm.

Revvy 07-30-2008 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by niquejim (Post 778509)
I have not had that beer so I can't really help, but I know someone who makes a Chouffe Houblin clone and says he's getting close. I don't know how close those 2 are but I can e-mail him for his recipe if you like


Yes please...anything that could get me in kinda a rough idea...

I found on another forum someone claiming he nailed it, but the guy never returned to that forum...evey year someone bumps the thread hoping he's back there....


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