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Old 10-21-2012, 11:28 PM   #1
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Default Parti-gyle from Imperial Stout?

I'm planning on brewing a Russian Imperial stout in a few weeks. I will definitely be maxing out my system (10 gallon cooler), with the grain bill listed below. I will also be switching from batch sparging to fly-sparging (will be the 2nd time doing it by then). So I set my efficiency at 60% (I usually get around 70% with batch sparging). I just started thinking about making a parti-gyle beer, but wasn't sure what to expect, since I have never made it before. I have read several different ideas about this process.

I want to try to brew this at the same time as the main RIS. So all I have is a 3 gallon pot to commit to the Parti-gyle beer. I do have about 3lbs of Light DME I can add as well. What I want to know is:

1) Is it better to brew a 2.5-3 gallon parti-gyle batch? or make a more concentrated beer (by adding the DME) and water it down as I put it in the fermenter bringing the total volume to 4-5 gallons?
2) With the OG of the 1st beer around 1.126, what sort of gravity could I expect from the Parti-gyle beer?
3) I would assume this would have to be a low gravity stout or porter. Is that correct? Any thoughts on yeasts or other options to do something different with this smaller beer?

Here's the original recipe:

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: Russian Imperial Stout
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons
Boil Size: 7 gallons
Efficiency: 60%

STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.115
Final Gravity: 1.023
ABV (standard): 11.95%
IBU (tinseth): 86.5
SRM (morey): 40

FERMENTABLES:
25 lb - Pale 2-Row (83.3%)
1.5 lb - Roasted Barley (5%)
1 lb - Caramel / Crystal 80L (3.3%)
1 lb - Flaked Barley (3.3%)
1 lb - Black Patent (3.3%)
0.5 lb - Chocolate (1.7%)

HOPS:
2 oz - Chinook (AA 12) for 45 min, Type: Pellet, Use: Boil
1.5 oz - Chinook (AA 12) for 30 min, Type: Pellet, Use: Boil
0.5 oz - Chinook (AA 12) for 0 min, Type: Pellet, Use: Boil

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Old 02-23-2013, 01:59 PM   #2
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Seems like a 30 pound grain bill for a five gallon brew would yield a beer with an O.G. of -probably- at least 1.050. I have had a hard time getting much past 1.040, but then I usually do 20-25 pound / 10 gallon brews. I also fight the astrigency of second runnings. Seems like extra hops covers that problem to a degree. But the way I see it, it's a free beer, only costing the water and heat to boil. So, at that price, it always tastes good.

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Old 02-23-2013, 06:22 PM   #3
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Im actually working out the same things with my planned barleywine/pale ale parti-gyle (which ive never tried before). have you ever mashed 30# in your tun before? according to Bobby M's table, http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/how-...-needs-123585/, 24lb would be your max grainbill at 70% efficiency. just something to think about.

Now, as I understand it, you can either split the total volume of beer you want to make 50/50 or 1/3-2/3. what were you hoping to make out of the smaller beer? My plan was to boil 3 gallons of the barleywine with added extract, calculate for utilization, then top up the fermenter to ~4 gallons. haven't quite gotten the calculations down yet.

as far as the gravity you can expect, this table http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue2.2/moshertable.html
is very helpful depending on whether you want to do an equal-sized boil or a 1/3-2/3. hope this helps!

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Old 02-23-2013, 07:22 PM   #4
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Why not mash the grains that require it and then steep the other grains before the boil.

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Old 02-24-2013, 02:57 AM   #5
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Read http://morebeer.com/brewingtechnique....2/mosher.html Click on the tables at the end for the math you need in regards to gravity, batch size and color. The beer loses color and flavor faster than gravity, so if you start with an imperial stout, the second beer may be more of a brown porter. If you're worried about efficiency, you can make the Imperial a 2.5G batch and the second a 5G (all #s approximate) or add DME to the stout as needed.

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Old 02-24-2013, 03:24 AM   #6
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Perfect thread, I am going to be brewing a beer on Wednesday. I am planning on an it being an imperial IPA but based on my expected numbers it's borderline barleywine. I really want to get all I can out of the grain and plan on doing a parti-gyle brew with my runnings if they are high enough and can extract enough wort without getting below that 1.010 number that I know starts to extract a whole bunch of tannins. I will be watching this tread closely and reading those links.

Quick question here, is it ok to just run that second collection right into a carboy and cap it with a stopper and brew it the next day? I really don't want an extra long brewday (yep, lazy).

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Old 02-24-2013, 07:59 PM   #7
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Thank you all for the responses. Truth be told I brewed this back in November. I'm trying to read through my notes, but I had so many written in different spots on this one, that I'm having trouble finding exactly what I ended up with. For what it's worth the results are phenomenal. A friend of mine and I both took a "sick day" to hang out and take on this task. We basically split the grain bill above down the middle and mashed in 2 10 gallon water coolers/mash tuns. I added a little to the base grain, but can't remember how much. I ended up with 6 gallons of 1.114 OG. The final result is absolutely delicious, and is right where I like in an imperial stout.

As for the partigyle beer...I ended up batch sparging with 10 qts in each cooler to end up with 20 qts going into the boil. I steeped an additional 1/2 lb. of Crystal 80 I had on hand. I can't find what the post boil gravity was, but I ended up adding about 1# of DME with some water to boost the gravity ending up with 5.5 gallons of 1.049 OG. I used .25 oz of Magnum for 60 min., .25 oz of Hallertau @ 30, .25 Hallertau @15. I used the Wyeast 2124 Bohemian Lager Yeast.

The Partigyle ended up being an amazing Black Lager. This was my first time using a lager yeast, so I'm not sure what is because of the yeast or because of the grain bill. It took a while for the funky nose to settle, but now this is a soft, roasty nose with a full flavor, light body and extremely clean finish at 4.5% abv. Everyone who has tried is expresses the same thing; it is one the smoothest, most drinkable, and refreshing dark beer they have ever had. The smoothness I attribute to the partigyle nature.

This was a really long and exhausting brew day due to 2 stuck sparges, having to use 2 different pots for the partigyle, and using an ice bath in the bath tub for the cold break. I have done a 2.5 gallon partigyle once before that went much smoother. My advice based on that one, is to watch how heavy you go on the hops, it's very easy to make it too bitter without having a bigger malt body to support it. My friend and I will definitely do this again, the only difference is we now have 2 full brew pots, with 2 propane burners and a coil chiller.

As far as saving the beer until the next day in a sterilized carboy...I forget why, but I have heard that you should only store it like that for a few hours. Other than that, I say give it a go. Enjoy and have fun.

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Old 03-07-2013, 12:14 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdopchibrew View Post
Im actually working out the same things with my planned barleywine/pale ale parti-gyle (which ive never tried before). have you ever mashed 30# in your tun before? according to Bobby M's table, http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/how-...-needs-123585/, 24lb would be your max grainbill at 70% efficiency. just something to think about.

Now, as I understand it, you can either split the total volume of beer you want to make 50/50 or 1/3-2/3. what were you hoping to make out of the smaller beer? My plan was to boil 3 gallons of the barleywine with added extract, calculate for utilization, then top up the fermenter to ~4 gallons. haven't quite gotten the calculations down yet.

as far as the gravity you can expect, this table http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue2.2/moshertable.html
is very helpful depending on whether you want to do an equal-sized boil or a 1/3-2/3. hope this helps!
I was curious about that gravity table. I looked at it, but are those numbers the pre-boil or post-boil estimates?
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