The Great Bottle Opener Giveaway

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Recipes/Ingredients > "Nirvana" - Taking a shot at a Utopia's-like brew.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-15-2013, 10:48 PM   #1
Shred
Non-Recovering Alcoholic
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Shred's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Manchester, CT
Posts: 846
Liked 143 Times on 96 Posts
Likes Given: 191

Default "Nirvana" - Taking a shot at a Utopia's-like brew.

I've got plans to do a Utopia's-like brew this fall/winter. My equipment limits me to a 2-gallon bottling volume, but it's going to be a beast of a project regardless.

The goal is to get a high-alcohol brew similar to, but not a clone of Utopias. The profile I'm shooting for is a lot of dark fruit, maple, oak, a hint of smoke, and layered, complex caramel flavors, a dark ruby-red color and something that oxidizes and ages well for years. I'm aiming for 22-25% ABV.

Here's the plan...


The Yeast:

1) Brew a 5 gallon batch of "normal" beer with Abbey Ale II 1762 (recipe below) and pitch the slurry.

2) When the yeast from the first batch starts to die down (probably around 12%, pitch champagne yeast. There has been some debate on this step and I'm still researching if there is a strain that won't kill off my next pitch. I personally know someone who did this with success.

3) Pitch the monster WLP099 (2 vials in a decanted, stepped starter).

4) Toss in some crushed up Beano when the WLP099 starts to slow down... again, there is some controversy here about whether the Beano needs to be denatured somehow once the yeast is done. I'm open to suggestion on this. This step may be completely eliminated, but I'm still researching.


The Brew:

120 minute mash. (Beano in mash???)

I'm going to be starting with a boil volume of 8-10 gallons. I'm expecting a 6-8 hour boil with a fan on the pot. Once we've gotten down to about where I think the 60 minute mark is I'll toss in the 60-minute hop addition.


The Recipes:

"Shred's Belgian Pale Ale" (5-Gallon "starter"):

7 lbs Maris Otter
2 lbs Vienna Malt
1 lbs Caramunich Malt
8.0 oz Aromatic Malt
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L
4.0 oz Wheat, Flaked

1.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min
1.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min

2.0 pkg Abbey Ale II

Est Original Gravity: 1.051 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.008 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.7 %
Bitterness: 25.1 IBUs


"NIRVANA":

Mash In Add 28.51 qt of water at 158.9 F 146.0 F 120 min
Sparge Step: Fly sparge with 6.00 gal water at 168.0 F

16 lbs Maris Otter
2 lbs Munich 10L
12.0 oz Toasted Malt
8.0 oz Melanoiden Malt
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 80L
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L
4.0 oz Peat Smoked Malt

1.00 oz Tettnang [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min
1.00 oz Spalter [4.50 %] - Boil 20.0 min
1.00 oz Hallertauer [4.80 %] - Boil 5.0 min
12.0 oz Maple Syrup (35.0 SRM) - Flame-out

4.00 Items Beano

1.00 oz Bourbon Soaked Oak Cubes (Secondary 21.0
days or to taste)

Est Original Gravity: 1.237 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.050 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 25


There it is. My dream in 500 words or less. I am wide open to suggestions on any step in the process. Particularly so if you have experience with a project like this.

__________________

- Shred

Check out my blog!
www.ShredsHomebrews.com

On Tap: Session Brown

Primary 1: Independence Pale Ale (4th of July IPA)
Primary 2: Dolph 2014 Imperial Stout
Primary 3: "Strong, Dark & Stoopid 2014" Belgian Dark Strong
Primary 4: Strawberry-Raspberry Belgian Wit
Primary 5: Shred's Oaked Strong Ale
Primary 6: Sara's Chianti
Secondary 1: Lambic-Style Sour Ale
Secondary 2: "Cirrhosis" 20% Barleywine

Shred is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-15-2013, 11:35 PM   #2
Shred
Non-Recovering Alcoholic
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Shred's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Manchester, CT
Posts: 846
Liked 143 Times on 96 Posts
Likes Given: 191

Default

Any thoughts on what to bottle this in would be appreciated as well. I'm aiming for something around 22 ounce bottles, but I want them to be somewhat fancy. Maybe something like a corked whiskey bottle or something. I've had no luck tracking anything like that down.

__________________

- Shred

Check out my blog!
www.ShredsHomebrews.com

On Tap: Session Brown

Primary 1: Independence Pale Ale (4th of July IPA)
Primary 2: Dolph 2014 Imperial Stout
Primary 3: "Strong, Dark & Stoopid 2014" Belgian Dark Strong
Primary 4: Strawberry-Raspberry Belgian Wit
Primary 5: Shred's Oaked Strong Ale
Primary 6: Sara's Chianti
Secondary 1: Lambic-Style Sour Ale
Secondary 2: "Cirrhosis" 20% Barleywine

Shred is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-16-2013, 04:21 AM   #3
Ralelen
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: West Hartford, CT
Posts: 152
Default

Glad to see another CT brewer. But how are you going to get such a high OG on the "Nirvana" batch with no base malt; unless Im missing something, I just got home from work and its late.

As for some fancy bottling, you could bottle in bombers and dip the neck into wax, which I believe they sell at Brew Wine and Hobby in East Hartford

__________________
Ralelen is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-16-2013, 04:41 AM   #4
biertourist
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Seattle, Washington (WA)
Posts: 519
Liked 42 Times on 35 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default

I wish you luck but others have tried this method and failed; I don't think you'll make it close to your target this way.

You need to brew multiple repitched batches of beer and keep repitching the yeast slurry to help get the alcohol tolerance of the yeast up; much like the Abbey / Trappist brewers do.

Sam Adam's also feeds the yeast incrementally only simple sugars later in fermentation and gives multiple high quantity oxygen shots (you're going to need pure oxygen to help the yeast get up sterol reserves to increase their alcohol tolerance). You'll want to dramatically simplify your grist and go with much more fermentable sugar or you're going to end up with syrup.


Brew a 1.080 beer first (Maybe using the super california strain?) then repitch the entire yeast cake to 1.100 gravity wort produced from mostly base malt (drop the crystal completely); mash low and slow. Oxygenate like crazy; plenty O yeast nutrients too.

-Make sure your freak WLP099 yeast has been propogated up via a 1.050 starter and then a second 1.080 starter with O2 at each propogation (or stirred).

Then once the 1.100 starter gets down to 1.035ish add your first highly concentrated simple sugar addition stirring it in well; once this ferments down to maybe 1.030 then add your freak WLP099 yeast and your second highly concentrated sugar addition; if the gravity keeps going down to 1.030 you can add more simple sugar syrup but in the later stages the yeast is only going to eat dextrose/glucose and nothing else.

Adam

__________________
biertourist is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-16-2013, 04:43 AM   #5
biertourist
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Seattle, Washington (WA)
Posts: 519
Liked 42 Times on 35 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default

If you make it to 18% stop the sugar additions and put your beer into a badass chest freezer or some food grade dry ice and use the "eis bock"/ fractional distillation/ freeze distillation method to further concentrate it to your desired level.


Adam

__________________
biertourist is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-16-2013, 04:45 AM   #6
biertourist
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Seattle, Washington (WA)
Posts: 519
Liked 42 Times on 35 Posts
Likes Given: 15

Default

WLP099 taste like @#$@; my theory is that it's just a distiller's "turbo yeast".


Adam

__________________
biertourist is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-16-2013, 01:56 PM   #7
Shred
Non-Recovering Alcoholic
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Shred's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Manchester, CT
Posts: 846
Liked 143 Times on 96 Posts
Likes Given: 191

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralelen View Post
Glad to see another CT brewer. But how are you going to get such a high OG on the "Nirvana" batch with no base malt; unless Im missing something, I just got home from work and its late.

As for some fancy bottling, you could bottle in bombers and dip the neck into wax, which I believe they sell at Brew Wine and Hobby in East Hartford
Haha! Oops. Missed an important ingredient. Edited the original post to include 16 lbs of marris otter.

Also - I live at Brew & Wine Hobby.
__________________

- Shred

Check out my blog!
www.ShredsHomebrews.com

On Tap: Session Brown

Primary 1: Independence Pale Ale (4th of July IPA)
Primary 2: Dolph 2014 Imperial Stout
Primary 3: "Strong, Dark & Stoopid 2014" Belgian Dark Strong
Primary 4: Strawberry-Raspberry Belgian Wit
Primary 5: Shred's Oaked Strong Ale
Primary 6: Sara's Chianti
Secondary 1: Lambic-Style Sour Ale
Secondary 2: "Cirrhosis" 20% Barleywine

Shred is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-16-2013, 02:10 PM   #8
Shred
Non-Recovering Alcoholic
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Shred's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Manchester, CT
Posts: 846
Liked 143 Times on 96 Posts
Likes Given: 191

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by biertourist View Post
I wish you luck but others have tried this method and failed; I don't think you'll make it close to your target this way.

You need to brew multiple repitched batches of beer and keep repitching the yeast slurry to help get the alcohol tolerance of the yeast up; much like the Abbey / Trappist brewers do.

Sam Adam's also feeds the yeast incrementally only simple sugars later in fermentation and gives multiple high quantity oxygen shots (you're going to need pure oxygen to help the yeast get up sterol reserves to increase their alcohol tolerance). You'll want to dramatically simplify your grist and go with much more fermentable sugar or you're going to end up with syrup.


Brew a 1.080 beer first (Maybe using the super california strain?) then repitch the entire yeast cake to 1.100 gravity wort produced from mostly base malt (drop the crystal completely); mash low and slow. Oxygenate like crazy; plenty O yeast nutrients too.

-Make sure your freak WLP099 yeast has been propogated up via a 1.050 starter and then a second 1.080 starter with O2 at each propogation (or stirred).

Then once the 1.100 starter gets down to 1.035ish add your first highly concentrated simple sugar addition stirring it in well; once this ferments down to maybe 1.030 then add your freak WLP099 yeast and your second highly concentrated sugar addition; if the gravity keeps going down to 1.030 you can add more simple sugar syrup but in the later stages the yeast is only going to eat dextrose/glucose and nothing else.

Adam
There's no question this is going to be a challenge and it's very possible I don't hit my target first time around (I will be washing the yeast from this brew for future uses).

I've seen the method you recommend before (I believe BYO did an article on this), but I've also personally seen others have success with my method. In fact, I've seen it done with no O2, just olive oil additions to get the already strong yeast population the fatty acids they needs to build strong cell walls. The guy who runs my LHBS used the olive oil method (basically on a bet) and managed to get a first generation 25%. I'll be using both O2 and olive oil.

I've also heard mixed things with 099's flavor profile... I'd be lying if I said it wasn't something I'd thought about, but that's exactly why I'm sharing here. If I do end up going with the 099 the hope is that the Belgian yeast flavors overpower it. If not, perhaps it mellows into something better in the next generation.

I appreciate the input!
__________________

- Shred

Check out my blog!
www.ShredsHomebrews.com

On Tap: Session Brown

Primary 1: Independence Pale Ale (4th of July IPA)
Primary 2: Dolph 2014 Imperial Stout
Primary 3: "Strong, Dark & Stoopid 2014" Belgian Dark Strong
Primary 4: Strawberry-Raspberry Belgian Wit
Primary 5: Shred's Oaked Strong Ale
Primary 6: Sara's Chianti
Secondary 1: Lambic-Style Sour Ale
Secondary 2: "Cirrhosis" 20% Barleywine

Shred is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-01-2013, 09:15 PM   #9
Shred
Non-Recovering Alcoholic
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 2 reviews
 
Shred's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Manchester, CT
Posts: 846
Liked 143 Times on 96 Posts
Likes Given: 191

Default

I just ordered my 099 and oak cubes... can't wait!

Gonna brew this monster on Thursday. The Belgian Pale Ale should be at terminal gravity at this point so I'll be harvesting the slurry from it while my boil down is at work.

Does anyone have tips for a good way to harvest the middle layer out of a bucket? I'm trying to avoid doing a wash if I can. My plan at the moment is to use a sanitized (brand new) flexible, plastic cutting board to scrape the top layer off and scoop up the nice white middle layer.

__________________

- Shred

Check out my blog!
www.ShredsHomebrews.com

On Tap: Session Brown

Primary 1: Independence Pale Ale (4th of July IPA)
Primary 2: Dolph 2014 Imperial Stout
Primary 3: "Strong, Dark & Stoopid 2014" Belgian Dark Strong
Primary 4: Strawberry-Raspberry Belgian Wit
Primary 5: Shred's Oaked Strong Ale
Primary 6: Sara's Chianti
Secondary 1: Lambic-Style Sour Ale
Secondary 2: "Cirrhosis" 20% Barleywine

Shred is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
"Brew House" vs "Actual Mash" Efficiency huntsman General Beer Discussion 5 12-07-2013 08:58 AM
Taking a stab at "extended mashing" adamjackson All Grain & Partial Mash Brewing 2 11-19-2012 05:22 AM
Woof...HUGE difference with "fresh" vs "not-so-fresh" commercial brew scrambledegg81 General Beer Discussion 15 08-20-2011 01:25 PM
Taking my winemaking skills from "cook" to "chef" levels. JasontheBeaver Wine Making Forum 5 07-28-2011 07:49 PM
Taking a "clone" to a brewing competition... JoeBronco General Beer Discussion 104 02-18-2011 07:10 PM