Spike Brewing 12.5 Conical Fermenter Giveaway - Enter Now!

Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Recipes/Ingredients > Jamil's Raison D'Saison AG Question

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-18-2012, 06:22 PM   #1
DumpsterDave
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 17
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default Jamil's Raison D'Saison AG Question

So I have listened to the podcast on the Brewing Network where he goes over the recipe, and even went out and bought Jamil's book. But I am a bit confused as to whether or not I need to have table sugar in my All-Grain version of his Raison D'Saison. The recipe specifies an OG of 1.060 and when I enter the recipe into BeerSmith with just the three grains, I get exactly 1.060 as my estimated OG. The AG notes in the recipe do not speficificly state that I need to have the pound of sugar, but they also do not directly state to omit it. Has anyone else brewed this (AG Version) before and did they add the sugar or not?

__________________
DumpsterDave is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-07-2012, 10:16 PM   #2
enricocoron
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: san diego, ca
Posts: 173
Liked 5 Times on 4 Posts

Default

I'm sorry nobody answered you, I just came on to look at Saison threads to try my first one. I'd say you would want the sugar in there for sure, because the style if meant to be very very dry. I also don't understand why he says that you mash at 149 for a Bel Golden which has a higher OG but you want as dry as possible and says 146 for this recipe. I'd go 149 with a lb. of Candy or Cane sugar and you should be good. I think you need to make sure you ramp the temperature pretty high towards the end.

__________________
enricocoron is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-08-2012, 03:08 PM   #3
DumpsterDave
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 17
Liked 1 Times on 1 Posts

Default

Here's where I'm confused on it though. Putting the recipe that he has in his book into beersmith (without the sugar) estimates an OG of 1.060. He recently had an article in the most recent BYO with another Saison recipe which DOES specify to add 1lb of cane sugar, but the grains are all much less and the recipe calls for the same OG. So far, Beersmith has always pretty much hit my OG targets dead on. I guess I can try two small batches, one with sugar, and one without and compare...

__________________
DumpsterDave is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-08-2012, 04:47 PM   #4
FarmerTed
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
FarmerTed's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 456
Liked 58 Times on 48 Posts
Likes Given: 120

Default

Keep in mind that he aims for 6 gallons post-boil, 5.5 gallons of that into the fermenter, and 5 of that in the finished beer. Set up BS for 6 gallons post-boil. I'm guessing you're aiming for 5.

__________________
FarmerTed is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-09-2012, 05:14 PM   #5
enricocoron
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: san diego, ca
Posts: 173
Liked 5 Times on 4 Posts

Default

1.060 is on the high side as well....make sure you don't overshoot, but yeah Farmer Ted is right, he always says for a six gallon batch. Don't elevate the OG too high, remember that just as much Alchohol can be generated finishing low as starting high, which is key for this style.

__________________
enricocoron is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-09-2012, 05:23 PM   #6
coypoo
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Cary, NC
Posts: 637
Liked 6 Times on 6 Posts

Default

What does he say his efficiency is and what do you have it set at on your BeerSmith?

__________________

Rowdy Reptile Brewing
http://rowdyreptilebrewing.blogspot.com/

coypoo is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-09-2012, 11:48 PM   #7
FarmerTed
HBT_LIFETIMESUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
FarmerTed's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 456
Liked 58 Times on 48 Posts
Likes Given: 120

Default

I think they shoot for 70% most of the time.

__________________
FarmerTed is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 05-10-2012, 01:37 AM   #8
Pie_Man
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Pie_Man's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Gainesville, FL
Posts: 1,344
Liked 133 Times on 125 Posts
Likes Given: 13

Default

I'm not familar with this episode, or the recipe from the book, but I'll speculate. Perhaps the sugar is added to the primary fermenter? This technique is sometimes done with Saisons. The sugar is added in a slurry solution just when primary fermentation starts to slow down. The theory is that yeast eat the simplest sugars first, so you want them to work on the more complex sugars and then feed them simple sugar after they're done with the maltose sugar. This helps to dry the beer out. I've heard on episodes of Brew Strong that it's more advantageous when the sugar percentage is around 20%. I've not tried the technique myself, just thought that might explain why the three grains equate to the recipe's OG.

__________________
Pie_Man is offline
docrw Likes This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 07-17-2014, 02:06 AM   #9
docrw
Mastermind Brewer
HBT_SUPPORTER.png
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
docrw's Avatar
Recipes 
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Seattle, Wa.
Posts: 19
Liked 2 Times on 1 Posts
Likes Given: 69

Default

Has anybody inverted the sugar in the boil by adding a little lemon juice to it. I have since that's the way Belgian candy is made and breaks down the sugar into simple sugars all at one time.

__________________

Grapefruit du Saison up next
Krazy Kat Blonde kegged
Big-Kat Helles bottled
Extra Squirrely Brew ESB
1554 clone and Lagunitas IIPA bottled
Stone Ruination bottled

docrw is offline
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options
Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DFH Raison D'etre EXTRACT recipe Esmitee Recipes/Ingredients 26 10-08-2013 12:31 AM
Jamil's Evil Twin Question DawgBrewer Recipes/Ingredients 3 09-18-2011 05:29 PM
Raison D'Etre - Has Anyone Made a Sucessful Batch? ultravista Recipes/Ingredients 11 02-18-2011 01:27 AM
Wanted: Dogfish Head Indian Brown Ale and Raison AG Recipes ultravista Recipes/Ingredients 2 01-28-2011 05:34 PM
DFH Raison d'Etre: Acidity? Brew-Happy Recipes/Ingredients 4 10-16-2009 07:30 PM