How does this barleywine look?

ericd · 08-03-2008, 11:08 PM

How does this (admittedly crazy) recipe look? Going for a Quad/Doppelbock malt profile with an American IPA hop bitterness (but more smooth). It's a lot of different malts, too many maybe? How do you think a 2-step fermentation, first with a German lager yeast then with a Belgian trappist would work?

Quote:

6 lbs Belgian pale 2-row
6 lbs Belgiant 2-row Pils
4 lbs munich
1 lb caramunich
14 oz vienna malt
6 oz wheat malt
4 oz aromatic malt
2 oz biscuit malt
2 oz cararoma
2 oz crystal 60L
2 oz crystal 80L
2 oz chocolate
2 oz special B
4 oz amber candi sugar
4 oz clear candi
1 oz dark candi

------------------------------

0.25 oz Amarillo 60 mins
0.4 oz Cascade 60 mins
0.25 oz Centennial 60 mins

0.3 oz Amarillo 45 mins
0.55 oz Cascade 45 mins
0.25 oz Centennial 45 mins

0.35 oz Amarillo 30 mins
0.55 oz Cascade 30 mins
0.3 oz Centennial 30 mins

0.55 oz Amarillo 15mins
0.85 oz Cascade 15 mins
0.45 oz Centennial 15 mins

----------------------
OG: 1.094
FG: 1.019
SRM: 23
IBUS: 71

5 gallon batch, but I will probably do a smaller one
Adjusted for 65% efficiency

Thanks! Don't forget to post your opinion!!

s3n8 · 08-04-2008, 12:07 AM

I have been plotting a barleywine as well.

Take a look at the 9-9-9 thread if you havent already, and there are a few other recipes under the strong ale section i think. I am shooting for 1.100 OG and 100 IBU using 2 row, rye, crystal and aromatic. Going to be mostly columbus and cascade hops.

I do not have any sage wisdom for you about the variety of malts though. I am a relative n00b myself.

MikeFlynn74 · 08-04-2008, 12:19 AM

Almost seems like its too many ingredients. I think a lot of the variances will get lost in the high Alcohol/hops that you are going to have.

IBUs seem a little on the low side for a Barley wine too. Id go more simple.

This is the yeast I would use-

YEAST STRAIN: 3787 | Trappist High Gravity™

Produces intense esters and phenolic characteristics with complex fruitiness. Does not produce significant amount of iso-amyl acetate (banana esters) or bubble gum esters typical of many yeast of this style. Phenol and ester production are influenced by fermentation temperatures. Phenols tend to dissipate as beer matures. This type of yeast benefits from incremental feeding of sugars during fermentation, making suitable conditions for doubles and triples, to ferment to dryness. True top cropping yeast with broad temperature range.

ericd · 08-04-2008, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeFlynn74

Almost seems like its too many ingredients. I think a lot of the variances will get lost in the high Alcohol/hops that you are going to have.

IBUs seem a little on the low side for a Barley wine too. Id go more simple.

You say that the malt nuances will get lost in all the hops I have (just 3 varieties?), but that the IBUs are too low? I don't understand.

Got the malt bill from averaging 25 Belgian Strongs and 25 Doppelbocks. I'm new to AG brewing so I'm wondering really what I can take out and what I can leave.

MikeFlynn74 · 08-04-2008, 01:49 AM

Well it was just my opinion. The 2oz additions wouldnt do entirely a lot for flavor. Plus with it being such a strong beer lots of subtitles get lost. But thats just my opinion.

I was wrong about the hops- Barley wines can swing from 50-100 so that looks good.

How long were you going to age it?

**niquejim** · 08-04-2008, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericd

How does this (admittedly crazy) recipe look? Going for a Quad/Doppelbock malt profile with an American IPA hop bitterness (but more smooth). It's a lot of different malts, too many maybe? How do you think a 2-step fermentation, first with a German lager yeast then with a Belgian trappist would work?

Thanks! Don't forget to post your opinion!!

6 lbs Belgian pale 2-row
6 lbs Belgiant 2-row Pils
4 lbs munich
1 lb caramunich
14 oz vienna malt
6 oz wheat malt
4 oz aromatic malt
2 oz biscuit malt
2 oz cararoma
2 oz crystal 60L
2 oz crystal 80L
2 oz chocolate
2 oz special B
4 oz amber candi sugar
4 oz clear candi
1 oz dark candi

Lose most of this(Pick one or maybe two with the flavors you want) or you're going to end up with muddled flavors. This is one of those times when less is more

**Yuri_Rage** · 08-04-2008, 02:07 AM

Depending on the maltster, there may not be two separate Belgian 2-row malts from which to choose
Vienna is like Biscuit
Crystal 60 is like Crystal 80, which is not far from Cararoma, which is like Caramunich
Special B will cover up the Chocolate
Wheat? Why?
4 oz clear candi + 1 oz dark candi approximates 5 oz amber candi
Amarillo, Cascade, and Centennial are all very similar hops

So, to simplify:
12 lbs Belgian pale
4 lbs Munich
1 lb Vienna
1/2 lb Crystal 80
1/4 lb Special B
1/2 lb Amber Candi
Buy one hops variety in bulk and use it for all additions

ericd · 08-04-2008, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yuri_Rage

Depending on the maltster, there may not be two separate Belgian 2-row malts from which to choose
Vienna is like Biscuit
Crystal 60 is like Crystal 80, which is not far from Cararoma, which is like Caramunich
Special B will cover up the Chocolate
Wheat? Why?
4 oz clear candi + 1 oz dark candi approximates 5 oz amber candi
Amarillo, Cascade, and Centennial are all very similar hops

So, to simplify:
12 lbs Belgian pale
4 lbs Munich
1 lb Vienna
1/2 lb Crystal 80
1/4 lb Special B
1/2 lb Amber Candi
Buy one hops variety in bulk and use it for all additions

Thanks Yuri, that is way cool and definately took some talent to make since of my mess. It looks like what I want to do. I saw many strong belgian recipes split the base malt between pils/pale. Is there any reason behind doing that or just random homebrew crazyness?

Also about the hops, the Amarillo/Cascade/Centennial trifecta seems to be what to use in IPAs and that's what I'm going for (sort of like a dark belgian IPA.) Are you saying that the subtle differences between them would get covered up by the malts? I was wondering if I should introduce some Styrian Goldings or German Tettnanger back in?

About the wheat, maybe it should be raw wheat, flaked wheat, or even wheat starch? At around 6 oz it would just be there to creamify texture/moutfeel and increase head retention.

Thanks for all the advice, very helpful.