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Old 04-22-2014, 03:40 PM   #1
vernet1
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Default Hoppy Saison de Fuego

Here goes:

8 lb MO (have a bunch on hand)
1 lb Wheat Malt
.5 lb Crystal 30

.75 oz EKG 60 min
1 oz Amarillo 5 min
1 oz Citra 5 min

WLP566

Habaneros for 5 days in secondary.

Questions:

How would some cilantro work in there?

If I want more pepper from the Saison yeast, is it best to ferment lower or higher?

Would I get more pepper from the WLP565? If so, can I finish it w/ S-05 to circumvent 565's sporadic behavior?

Going for essentially a refreshing peppery, slightly spicy, fruity hop forward summer ale.

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Old 04-24-2014, 03:32 AM   #2
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kinda unusual grain bill for a saison. Pilsner would be much more typical than MO.

I'd monitor the peppers closely and taste daily. It's really easy to overdo them. Personally, I think the yeast is spicy enough on its own for a summer brew, but your taste may vary.

That yeast will perform well if you ramp up temp. eg start in normal ale range and then keep pushing it higher and higher. 80+ is perfectly reasonable. The thing you really want to avoid is a temp drop at any point.

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Old 04-24-2014, 02:55 PM   #3
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I have seen more double-pitched saisons finished with Wyeast 3711 French Saison than with US-05. The saison yeast continues to contribute flavor. If you'd prefer to go with dry, then Fermentis T-58 is also known known for peppery flavor.

Billl is right - it's easy to overdo chiles and you'll need to monitor your additions. One of my best students, who intended to go on to the Siebel Institute, made a chile beer that was atrocious. You might think about cutting back on the chiles and adding some grains of paradise or black pepper. If the goal is refreshing, then you don't want to veer into actual fuego.

Cilantro is also easy to overdo. Like lavender, there's a narrow range between not enough, exactly right, and way too much.

You might think about Centennial as your bittering hop, rather than EKG, to boost the citrus.

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Old 04-24-2014, 03:05 PM   #4
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pepper = ferment hotter. T-58 will definitely give you pepper (at any temp).

consider making a tincture of habanero by soaking the peppers in some vodka or everclear. then dose conservatively in the keg or bottling bucket, taste, and decide if you want more. i suspect that carbonation will enhance the heat, so go lower than you think.

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What hops should I grow? Hop grower's comparison table. Looking for cheap honey?

Drinking: a farmhouse with ECY08 & brett blend
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Old 04-29-2014, 07:24 PM   #5
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Thanks everyone for the feedback. I'll finish out w/ the T-58 as recommended.

sptaylor, how would changing the bittering hop up the citrus? Would it actually contribue citrus flavor, or just change the quality of the bitterness?

Thanks!

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Old 04-29-2014, 09:09 PM   #6
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There's always a flavor carryover in a bittering hop. Chinook, for example, has a reputation for a harsh bitterness with a dank quality. Goldings and Fuggles give an earthy bitterness, Goldings more refined. Galena is valued as a bittering hop because it has a well-rounded flavor profile. And Centennial brings some citrus overtones with it in bittering applications (see, for example, Biermuncher's opening discussion about finding the right bittering hop for his Centennial Blonde).

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Old 04-30-2014, 01:31 AM   #7
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with 1 oz Amarillo @ 5 min and 1 oz Citra @ 5 min, any flavor carry-over from the bittering hop will be very hard to detect for the vast majority of drinkers. with amarillo and citra that late in the boil you should have plenty of citrus. you should be looking there for your citrus.

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Originally Posted by sptaylor70 View Post
(see, for example, Biermuncher's opening discussion about finding the right bittering hop for his Centennial Blonde).
that beer has very little late hopping, so some of the not-so-late hops can make a contribution. speaking of: there is a second centennial addition, equal to the first, at 35 mins. if there is centennial flavor in there that's where it's coming from.
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What hops should I grow? Hop grower's comparison table. Looking for cheap honey?

Drinking: a farmhouse with ECY08 & brett blend
Fermenting: sour cherry mead, imperial chocolate stout and its not-so-small beer second runnings, our bruin & a few other sours
Aging: a bunch of belgian and soured stuff, and acerglyn.
Up next: harvest ale with homegrown hops
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Old 04-30-2014, 12:09 PM   #8
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I have about a pound of German Tettnanger as well; how is the bittering flavor/quality different between that and EKG?

Thanks!

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Old 04-30-2014, 04:34 PM   #9
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They're both excellent. Slightly spicy, a little floral, refined. I think that you'll be happy with either.

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Old 04-30-2014, 04:40 PM   #10
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It's a cool idea, I'm always up for a cool saison recipe. But as the poster above said, I wouldn't us MO. Try and get some pilsen

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