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Old 06-16-2008, 06:21 PM   #41
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Here is a link for ways to culture wild yeast. Any one want to give the last one (Other options) a go?
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Other sources
You probably don't need to the know this, but in the interest of
intellectual honesty, you can also get yeast cultures from moldy hay,
bird droppings, feathers, insects and soil
Flashbacks of craigtube. "shudders"
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Old 06-16-2008, 07:12 PM   #42
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Been reading this and it sounds like fun.

I haven't seen anyone suggesting malting popcorn kernels yet. Not much sugar but they do germinate well. (Not the bagged microwave type of course). This could help provide some enzymes. Maybe malt them then toast them bit for roasted flavor?

Apparently, old civilizations brewed potatoes (sweet or otherwise) and helped the process by spitting in the mash. Provided the alpha amylase enzyme, but they had no clue. Any takers??

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Old 06-16-2008, 07:45 PM   #43
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Been reading this and it sounds like fun.

I haven't seen anyone suggesting malting popcorn kernels yet. Not much sugar but they do germinate well. (Not the bagged microwave type of course). This could help provide some enzymes. Maybe malt them then toast them bit for roasted flavor?
This is exactly what I had planned, but more of the ornamental corn that's still on the cob, for some more flavor, and perhaps some homany.
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Old 06-16-2008, 08:02 PM   #44
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In re: Malta Goya. The Malta Goya available in the Mid-Atlantic and Northeast states is, to the best of my knowledge, brewed at The Lion Brewery in Wilkes-Barre, PA. I know for a fact they were brewing it in 2004, for I saw them bottling it.

A little bird in the brewhouse told me that, if I wanted to know what it tasted like fermented, I should drink a Stegmaier Porter. If I wanted to taste the unfermented Porter wort after it had been carbonated, I should grab a bottle of Malta off the line.

Shh! Don't tell anyone!

I'm getting in on this concept. I'm due to brew something anyhow. GrapeNuts. That's what I'm doing: GrapeNuts.

After all, GrapeNuts is a Hefeweizen mash, in that it's 50/50% barley/wheat. Hm. Just soak it like the Sumerians did with their liquid ode to Ninkasi and get some yeast in there. Hmmmmmm.

Cheers,

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Old 06-17-2008, 04:53 AM   #45
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The Sumerians had grapenuts?

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Old 06-17-2008, 01:42 PM   #46
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I have a question about using honey for fermentable sugar, what are the chances of botchulism?? It there any way to prevent it? My SWMBO was warning me baout htis last night, is there still a chance of it occuring even in pasterized honey?

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Old 06-17-2008, 01:46 PM   #47
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I have a question about using honey for fermentable sugar, what are the chances of botchulism?? It there any way to prevent it? My SWMBO was warning me baout htis last night, is there still a chance of it occuring even in pasterized honey?
I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that nothing could live in honey, pasturized or otherwise, including botulism...

That is the rational a lot of folk medicine types use to justify taking unpasturized honey for stuff. (I even had a doctor friend who swore by it...I think it was he who first told me nothing bad could live in honey.)

I heard the same thing from a mead make the other day, who doestn't even pasturize his mead...
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Old 06-17-2008, 02:16 PM   #48
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http://diseases.emedtv.com/infant-botulism/botulism-in-honey.html

From the way I read it, botulism is in honey, about 10 % from the article, but humans over the age of 1 can handle the minumal amount.
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Old 06-17-2008, 02:28 PM   #49
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This sounds like it could be pretty cool. I couldnt tell, but do the rules specify that you can't culture yeast from beer you buy at the store? My grocery store sells Rogue, Sierra Nevada and some random Hefes, all of which are unfiltered. I was also thinking you could collect yeast in a similar manner as you would to make sourdough bread...maybe a sour beer?

Quote from wikipedia on sourdough:

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Biology and chemistry of sourdough

Two loaves of naturally-leavened (sourdough) bread.A sourdough starter is a stable symbiotic culture of bacteria and yeast present in a mixture of flour and water. The yeasts Candida milleri or Saccharomyces exiguus usually populate sourdough cultures symbiotically with Lactobacillus sanfranciscensis.[1]. Lactobacillus sanfranciscensis (bacteria) was named for its discovery in San Francisco sourdough starters.

Often a starter will consist of basic items such as: water, bread flour, rye flour and a sourdough starter which can be purchased at certain grocery stores. Once the starter is made water and flour must be added in time increments over a period of days. Depending on the locale of the bakery and the type of bread being made, the starter can be either a relatively fluid batter or a stiffer dough; as a general rule, the more sour breads are made with a liquid starter. Firm starters (such as the Flemish Desem starter) are often more resource-intensive, traditionally being buried in a large container of flour to prevent drying out.

A fresh culture begins with a mixture of flour and water. Fresh flour naturally contains a wide variety of yeast and bacteria spores. When wheat flour contacts water, naturally-occurring amylase enzymes break down the starch into complex sugars (sucrose and maltose); maltase converts the sugars into glucose and fructose that yeast can metabolize. The lactobacteria feed mostly on the metabolism products from the yeast. [1] The mixture develops a balanced, symbiotic culture after repeated feedings.

There are several ways to increase the chances of creating a stable culture. Unbleached, unbromated flour contains more microorganisms than more processed flours. Bran-containing (wholemeal) flour provides the greatest variety of organisms and additional minerals, though some cultures use an initial mixture of white flour and rye flour or "seed" the culture using unwashed organic grapes (for the wild yeasts on their skins). Using water from boiled potatoes also increases the leavening power of the bacteria, by providing additional starch. Bakers recommend un-chlorinated water for feeding cultures. Adding a small quantity of diastatic malt provides maltase and simple sugars to support the yeasts initially.[2]

The flour-water mixture can also be inoculated from a previously kept culture. The culture is stable due to its ability to prevent colonization by other yeasts and bacteria as a result of its acidity and other anti-bacterial agents. As a result, many sourdough bread varieties tend to be relatively resistant to spoilage and mold.
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Old 06-17-2008, 03:16 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by dirtymike1 View Post
http://diseases.emedtv.com/infant-botulism/botulism-in-honey.html

From the way I read it, botulism is in honey, about 10 % from the article, but humans over the age of 1 can handle the minumal amount.
Warning: Geek info ahead from my microbiology days...

The bacterium Clostridium botulinum is a spore forming bacterium, meaning it can survive in a dormant state in conditions not suitable to growth for a long time. There are two types of disease acquired by humans from this bacterium: infection and intoxication. You hear about "infant botulism"... that's an infection. This means the bacteria are actually feeding on and reproducing in the body. It can be caused be eating raw honey or even being exposed to soil dusts (construction, farming). Healthy adults can easily resist an infection by this bacterium. Foods high in sugar or fats have a lower moisture content and don't support the growth of bacteria. Honey, jambs, jellies, etc fall into this category. But if the honey has C. botulinum spores in it (dormant), they can infect the human body (infants).

Intoxication from C. botulinum is when an individual gets sick from a toxin already produced by the bacteria, not from the bacteria itself. Production of this toxin requires conditions suitable for growth for the bacteria. The infamous "swelled cans" are a sign of C. botulinum growth.

Pasteurization doesn't kill C. botulinum spores, but a healthy adult won't get sick from it and it won't hurt to brew with it since fermented beverages aren't suitable for growth of the bacterium either. Just don't put it in your infant's bottle.
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