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Old 08-19-2009, 09:50 PM   #1
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Default Extra Special Rye French Saison? huh? yes.

Hey everyone. I'm working on another recipe, this time an ESB-like beer that will be a bit hoppier, have some rye in it, and be fermented with a French Saison yeast and then dry hopped. I have no idea what category this is or what to call it, but I think it is going to be a fun beer.

Here is what I am thinking for the grain bill so far (my eff is 80%):

Amount Item Type % or IBU
8 lbs 8.0 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 72.34 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) Grain 12.77 %
1 lbs Victory Malt (25.0 SRM) Grain 8.51 %
12.0 oz Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 6.38 %

OG 1.066. Going to use Wyeast 3711 French Saison yeast.

I am basing this on an ESB I really enjoyed, but adding the rye and caramunich instead of the caramel malts. I am also going to mash lower to leave it dryer. What do you guys thinking about this? Is it possible to make a really dry beer with caramel in it? Would it be terrible? Also, what about victory with this dry style?

I am thinking of Sterling/Centennial/Cascade/Amarillo hops for this one...

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Old 08-19-2009, 10:00 PM   #2
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I`ve been fermenting a similar, but more traditional saison malt bill with cascade hops at 60, 20, and 5 mins (35IBUs) with WLP566, which is probably the closest white labs equivalent. Nice to hear somebody else thought a similar idea would be tasty.

A couple random thoughts:

no sugar to help dry it out?

I bet the fruityish northwest hops go well with the saison esters. I`ll let you how mine goes when I bottle in a couple of weeks. What does the rye add? I really have no idea....

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Old 08-19-2009, 10:03 PM   #3
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Since you're using malted rye, I'd suggest upping the amount a bit. Flaked -- if you weren't familiar with it -- will give you a sharper rye flavor, ounce per ounce. Since that's what I like, that's what I use, at 1.5 lbs to 7 lbs light LME (plus a couple more things, of course). Just a thought.

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Old 08-19-2009, 10:43 PM   #4
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Thanks for the tips. I already have a bunch of malted rye, so I'm using that. i'll up it a bit. Might also add sugar to dry it out. Bendbiker - I'm using rye to give it a spicy/crisp/dry flavor.

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Old 08-19-2009, 11:06 PM   #5
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I really like Sterling to compliment the rye. My favorite rye ale uses Sterling and Crystal.

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Old 08-19-2009, 11:16 PM   #6
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Does anyone have anything to say about the victory or caramunich? More? Less? Crazy?

Also, my other Saison used Pilsner malt, and I'm going to try pale in this one. I suppose I should probably go with some sugar in here.

The other thing I'm wondering about is whether or not I should toss a bit of torrified wheat in the mix too.

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Old 08-19-2009, 11:40 PM   #7
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I just bottled a Saison last week. I used 30% Rye malt. The sample that I tried was delicious. Go for it, the worst that can happen is that you wont love it.

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Old 09-15-2009, 07:03 AM   #8
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So here is the final recipe. Bottled it tonight. It is delicious!

This is for an 11G batch.

1.052 at 80% efficiency

8 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 40.00 %
5 lbs Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) Grain 25.00 %
2 lbs Victory Malt (25.0 SRM) Grain 10.00 %
1 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 5.00 %
1 lbs Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) Grain 5.00 %
10.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 3.13 %
6.0 oz Caramunich Malt (56.0 SRM) Grain 1.88 %
1.50 oz Sterling [7.00 %] (60 min) Hops 21.4 IBU
0.50 oz Summit [17.00 %] (30 min) Hops 8.8 IBU
0.75 oz Summit [17.00 %] (10 min) Hops 5.2 IBU
1.00 oz Sterling [7.50 %] (10 min) Hops 3.1 IBU
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] (10 min) Hops 2.2 IBU
1.15 oz Cascade [5.50 %] (0 min) Hops -
2oz Cascade Dry hops 14 days
2 lbs Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (1.0 SRM) Sugar 10.00 %

I only got half of this beer, because I split it with a friend. Here is what I did with my 5.5 gallons:

3711 french saison yeast. Fermented in primary for 1 week, added dry hops (1oz cascade), left in fermenter for 14 more days, then bottled with 4.5oz of corn sugar (in 5.125 gal of beer)

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Old 09-15-2009, 08:06 AM   #9
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that sounds like a very nice beer.
I can't wait to get home and get a brew day going.

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