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Old 02-24-2012, 06:25 PM   #11
mitrrek
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Yeah, I'm interested in an update on this as well. Alpine Spring is one of my favorites. I'd like to try this for a end of summer brew.

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Old 02-24-2012, 08:06 PM   #12
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I had a recipe that included Munich instead of any honey malt, although it was with lager yeast and such. Perhaps a SF Steam Beer lager yeast would produce a smooth flavor similar to a traditional lagering process?

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Open log Fermenting and gas-can secondary?? I am planning my next brew right now!!
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Old 03-07-2012, 11:37 PM   #13
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Sorry for the delay on the update...

I have been waiting for it to carb up properly and condition a bit before updating this recipe.

Color:
As you can see below, the color is almost spot on, the Alpine Spring on the right is actually pretty clear for what they claim to be a Schwarzbier. Using Kolsch Yeast I think I was able to achieve the slight cloudiness of what the Alpine Spring is usually like on tap, I may have let my AS bottles sit a bit too long and the yeast settled out. Without using lager yeast, I think Kolsch 2565 is the closest thing you can get to a true lager



Smell:
I can say that the AS smells hoppier, I do not really believe that it is only 19 IBU's like it says on the website, I am thinking they may have dry hopped the AS to get this characteristic or they actually are using more hops.

Taste:
My AS clone is sweet from the honey malt and since it was fermented with Kolsch yeast at a little higher than normal temperature, you get some fruitiness without it being too noticeable. I do not taste the lemon zest I put in it but this could be due to me putting it in at the start of the boil rather than at flame out. Overall this is a good beer, it went where I wanted it to go for being a good spring beer, not super light but not super heavy. It has just enough taste to let you know its not your average light beer, I think the Kolsch yeast plays a big part of that.

As mentioned above the AS smells hoppier and taste's hoppier as well, not much but it is noticeable. I am thinking that if I were to brew this again to try and match the original, I would most likely scale back the honey malt and/or up the amount of hops a bit to get a little more bitterness.

Final Word:
For being less than 5 weeks old (1.5 weeks in the keg), this beer seems to be getting better and better each day. I would make this again to try to achieve a little more bitterness but not much, I actually prefer my beer to the AS clone now that I have them side by side. I recommend giving this recipe a try, I think its a solid brew that you could always tweak to fit your taste. If the beer changes as time goes by I will update but I do not think this will last long on tap at my house.

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Old 03-08-2012, 02:44 PM   #14
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Can you give more comparisons on the taste differences between the two besides yours not being as hoppy? Color is good, head looks good, but does it taste anything like the Alpine Spring? What's similar, what's different?

I'm wondering if brewing it with a steam beer yeast (SF Lager) would produce closer taste since AS is a lager.

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Open log Fermenting and gas-can secondary?? I am planning my next brew right now!!
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Old 03-08-2012, 05:31 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tre9er View Post
Can you give more comparisons on the taste differences between the two besides yours not being as hoppy? Color is good, head looks good, but does it taste anything like the Alpine Spring? What's similar, what's different?

I'm wondering if brewing it with a steam beer yeast (SF Lager) would produce closer taste since AS is a lager.
Sure, I will try to describer mine versus AS a little better....

I think the main difference is that AS uses a true lager yeast which gives fruity characteristics of a german style lager such as a Octoberfest/Marzen. I have never had a true kellerbier but I would imagine that this would be what I am describing. Correct me if I am wrong but, couldn't you harvest the yeast out of the bottle of AS? It seems like you should be able to based on the sludge in the bottom of the bottle so this would probably get you what you want. I am not sure a steam beer is what you would want since I have never had one so I recommend using a german lager yeast on this one at first.

I accomplish the fruitiness in my version via the minor amount of lemon zest and the Kolsch yeast which I think will only get more 'lager like' as it ages. I used the 2565 yeast as a way to quickly get a result to see if I was in the ballpark of an AS clone.

If you were to drink these side by side like I did last night, you would notice that my version is actually smoother but with less of the Tettnang smell and citrus flavor. They are similar but obviously not exactly alike, noting the differences I described above. I will update this once I have let mine age more since the Kolsch yeast seems to get better with age.
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Old 03-08-2012, 05:48 PM   #16
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So perhaps some more late hop additions and you'd have achieved some of the citrusy flavor/aroma from the Tettnang. I mentioned SF Lager yeast because it can be fermented at higher temps than tradtional lager yeasts but is still a lager yeast. So similar to how you used a Kolsch (ale) yeast in order to get a quicker, perhaps easier version of the beer, I'm guessing the SF Lager yeast would also accomplish this.

I had more IBU's in the recipe I scratched down. 2oz at 60 and dry hop with 1.5. I might move some of those into the 30 minute range for flavor.

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Open log Fermenting and gas-can secondary?? I am planning my next brew right now!!
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Old 03-08-2012, 05:52 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tre9er View Post
So perhaps some more late hop additions and you'd have achieved some of the citrusy flavor/aroma from the Tettnang. I mentioned SF Lager yeast because it can be fermented at higher temps than tradtional lager yeasts but is still a lager yeast. So similar to how you used a Kolsch (ale) yeast in order to get a quicker, perhaps easier version of the beer, I'm guessing the SF Lager yeast would also accomplish this.

I had more IBU's in the recipe I scratched down. 2oz at 60 and dry hop with 1.5. I might move some of those into the 30 minute range for flavor.
Yes, later additions should get you more taste but 2 oz for a 5 gallon batch will put you way over the 19 IBU they list on the SA website. I did read up on the SF Lager yeast and that looks good to me as long as it gets you that Marzen/Helles fruitiness. Please post back if you end up trying this out
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Old 03-08-2012, 06:10 PM   #18
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I would likely move to 1.25oz. at 60 and half ounce each at 30, 0, then dry-hop with 1oz. From what I've gathered there is hop aroma but not much hop flavor, just a hint of citrus. I am skeptical of the low IBU's SA claims. I think in the 20's is more appropriate.

Been wanting to make this for some time. My grain bill is 70/30 Pilsner/Munich though. Mashing higher for some mouthfeel, 154, and Color in the 7 range SRM. If you think yours came out at a true 9, I may up the munich some.

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Open log Fermenting and gas-can secondary?? I am planning my next brew right now!!
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Old 03-08-2012, 08:57 PM   #19
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Color on my recipe in BeerSmith was 5.3 and I would say that I am a tad lighter than AS so you could up the munich(honey?) a bit.

I am curious why you are using those malts, have you seen the description on the SA site where they say its 2 row and honey malt? That is the reason I went the way I did, I actually bought pilsner malt before I read that it was 2 row so I switched it up.

Also, I mashed at 152 and mouthfeel is comparable to AS

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Old 03-09-2012, 12:43 AM   #20
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I will look at their website again. At the time I was cobbling things together from everywhere.

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