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Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Beer > Recipes/Ingredients > 3 FLoyds Zombie Dust attempt. Help/info requested
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Old 10-15-2012, 05:52 PM   #691
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So here's a bit of a curve ball. I brewed sort of a brown IPA, nothing to do with Zombie Dust, with a combination of Amarillo, and Chinook. It turned out the hop profile of this combination is pretty much spot on with ZD.

I have tried to make ZD twice before. First was all Citra, next was 50/50 Citra and Simcoe. Neither were nearly as close as Amarillo/Chinook.

I gave a friend one of these beers, not mentioning anything about ZD, and the first thing he said was, "this smells exactly like Zombie Dust"

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Old 10-16-2012, 02:23 AM   #692
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Originally Posted by J343MY
So here's a bit of a curve ball. I brewed sort of a brown IPA, nothing to do with Zombie Dust, with a combination of Amarillo, and Chinook. It turned out the hop profile of this combination is pretty much spot on with ZD.

I have tried to make ZD twice before. First was all Citra, next was 50/50 Citra and Simcoe. Neither were nearly as close as Amarillo/Chinook.

I gave a friend one of these beers, not mentioning anything about ZD, and the first thing he said was, "this smells exactly like Zombie Dust"
Please pm me the recipe!
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Old 10-17-2012, 12:41 AM   #693
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Please pm me the recipe!
next time I brew this I am going to try something like this:

91% 2-row
5% Melanoiden
4% White wheat

0.5 columbus at 60mins
1oz chinook & 1 oz amarillo at 10mins
2oz chinook & 2 oz amarillo whirlpool

Wyeast 1968

Dry Hop with 2oz chinook & 2oz amarillo for about a week
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Old 10-17-2012, 01:06 AM   #694
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Not gonna say it doesn't smell like the real deal since i haven't smelled it, but ZD is a citra beer (used to be advertised as all citra).

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Old 10-17-2012, 01:35 AM   #695
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Not gonna say it doesn't smell like the real deal since i haven't smelled it, but ZD is a citra beer (used to be advertised as all citra).
Exactly. it used to be advertised as all citra, but it isn't anymore, which makes me think they may have changed it. Perhaps when they decided to start bottling it, they just couldn't contract for enough citra, so it changed.

On my first attempt with all citra, the hop profile wasn't even in the same realm as ZD. ZD has some pine, which you just don't get will all citra. I tried Citra/Simcoe, and it still wasn't there.

It may be something like citra/chinook. but the chinook/amarillo was the closest thing I have found so far.
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Old 10-17-2012, 12:10 PM   #696
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I find it highly unlikely it would go from all citra to no citra.

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Old 10-17-2012, 05:55 PM   #697
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I find it highly unlikely it would go from all citra to no citra.
Your last few posts haven't added anything of value to this discussion. All I was saying is that I don't think its all citra anymore. More likely it could be a combo of citra and something else. It's also in the realm of possibility that it doesn't contain citra at all anymore.
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Old 10-17-2012, 06:25 PM   #698
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Your last few posts haven't added anything of value to this discussion. All I was saying is that I don't think its all citra anymore. More likely it could be a combo of citra and something else. It's also in the realm of possibility that it doesn't contain citra at all anymore.
This has all been discussed already. There may have been a change, likely to the bittering hop. Someone who knew one of the Floyd's chimed in thinking that was the case as well. No one is absolutely positive if they began using something else, but we do know they no longer advertise it as all Citra.
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Old 10-17-2012, 06:59 PM   #699
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I'll agree. I strongly believe they are bittering it with something other than Citra. This won't have a huge affect on a clone recipe, other allowing you to cut back on the amount of Citra needed.

I highly doubt there's anything other than Citra after the bittering addition. I've heard FFFs talk about how they want to try to phase out Amarillo, so I can't seen them adding Amarillo to the recipe. Not to say Amarillo won't make a tasty beer.

Now for the heart of my rant. Hops of the same variety VARY. A LOT

Over the past year, I've bought Citra from four sources. All four hops smelled different. I could tell they were all similar, and were all Citra, but they were different. Soil conditions, growing conditions, when the farmers trained the bines, when the hops were harvested, the process and temperature of the pelletizer, which way the damn wind was blowing, etc all influence the hop.

This is one thing that homebrewers really don't realize. Commercial brewers choose their hops every year. And I don't mean they choose between varieties. No, they literally choose which cascade they want. Hop Union will give them a chunk of hops cut from the bale (called a brewer's cut) of say, Citra from various farms. They will then choose which they like the best.

Simcoe is a great example because it's only grown by three hop farmers. Brewers will tell you (there's a video out there of Vinnie talking about) that all three are a little bit different. He uses all three, but only uses one for dry hopping, and only uses another early in the boil.

So getting back to my point about Citra. One of the four batches of Citra I got was ridiculously tropical fruit-like. It just absolutely reeked like fruit punch, so much, that it was hard to smell the hop. Another was a nice mix of tropical fruit and citrus, another was a mix of heavy resin and mango, and the final one was mostly resin, and was a little bit catty.

So say I brew 4 batches of Zombie dust using those four different batches of Citra. They are going to taste different. Two or three of them will taste a lot like ZD, but the hop that was resiny and catty probably won't be that close. FFF's probably didn't choose a catty crop of Citra when they got their brewer's cuts. Make sense?

CTZ is probably the best example. Dry hop a beer with crappy CTZ, and you'll know what I'm talking about. CTZ is great when it's 'good'. Dank, resin, a little citrus, and very 'cannabis' like. When it's bad, it's oniony, musty, and almost dirty tasting.

This is one area where homebrewers are still at a bit of a disadvantage when it comes to ingredients. We're often stuck with whatever the LHBS has. Especially with the popular aroma varieties.

rant

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Old 10-17-2012, 07:59 PM   #700
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Submitted mine to the comp out here. Man it was hazy, there was extra citra in my hop packs so I ended up dry hopping with 4 ounces in each 5 gallon fermenter. Hopefully I won't get docked too bad for the haziness but man was it hoppy! You bring up a great point scottland, the citra I am using mainly is resinous with strong mango flavor. I get a lot of the flavors from torpedo IPA. But I agree this is a great recipe. I might try it again with different hops just because of how hard it is to get citra, some simcoe might be a nice addition I love that little bit of pine it imparts.

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