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Old 07-14-2009, 09:11 PM   #61
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Snickasaurusrex,

I was just on the Dark Candi inc. site and I noticed that there is a difference between the dark and dark 2 products that they sell. For all of their candi syrups except Dark 2 they state under the description "Candi syrup is a liquid obtained as a by-product of the candi sugar production". We already know this, and they state that they do this by boiling the sugar and then centrifuging off the solid sugar crystals leaving the syrup. However, the Dark 2 product has a completely different description which reads "Sugar syrup obtained from repeated heating and cooling of beet sugar". No where does it mention centrifuging or removing the sugar crystals.

So perhaps the Sugar #5 that you describe is more closely replicating the Dark 2 product. Like you mentioned it is allowing more of the available sucrose to be converted by undergoing the maillard reaction twice. Thereby allowing more concentrated flavors. Maybe the main reason they remove the sugar crystals is to add shelf life to prevent crystalization which you state doesn't happen with the Sugar #5 recipe.

Just thought I would share this tidbit of info that I found on their website and my interpretation of what it means. I love this thread because I really think it goes to show that a product like this can be replicated just like cloning beer itself. Awesome job!

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Old 07-28-2009, 08:28 PM   #62
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I know your recipes are for syrup, but if I was interested in making hard candy would I just leave out the second water addition? Or as my brain slowly works through this, I wonder if it is possible to get to hard crack stage while doing the Maillard processes? Am I crazy for even thinking about making hard candy?

Terje

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Old 07-28-2009, 09:33 PM   #63
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What would be your reason for making the candy rather than the syrup? From what I understand the temp you take it up to after adding the water determines what the sugar will turn into after cooling. This is the reason for the hard crack temperature I believe.

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Old 07-28-2009, 09:44 PM   #64
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I don't have any jars in the house right now, and was feeling a bit lazy about driving to buy some. Also, with the issue of shelf stability, I was thinking that solid crystals should be more stable. Probably a bad idea all around, as the temp makes the color/flavour with the Maillard compounds. If it was only invert sugar, just raising the temp to hard crack wouldn't get significant color or flavour change.

Off I go to Wally World.

Terje

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Old 08-04-2009, 01:47 PM   #65
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Out of all the folks that have tried making this, what's the best beer recipe in which to use it? English brown? Belgian dubbel?

I made a batch of the 290*F syrup last night. I definitely taste plums, raisins, figs, etc. Color is a bit darker (like the 300*F) even though the flavors came out like your 290*F.

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Old 08-04-2009, 02:53 PM   #66
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i used the 280*F in a Tripel I brewed a couple months ago and just bottled last week. Its still young and a little hot on the alcohol, but so far all signs point to awesome.

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Old 08-27-2009, 06:52 AM   #67
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I made a test batch tonight. I made the #5 sugar and hit all the temps according to my thermometer. I have tested this thermometer and it is accurate at both boiling temps and ice water. However, the candi syrup came out the blackest of blacks. I was under the impression that the #5 sugar would be slightly darker than the 290F deep amber but not jet black.

Regardless, it tasted great and very much like strong raisins with a bitter sweet chocolate and toast flavor. Like Snickasaurausrex said it tasted a lot like very dark chocolate which has that bittersweet flavor to it.

I'll be making a total of 3-4 pounds of this for a Westvleteren 12 clone and hopefully it adds the color and flavor complexity I'm looking for. Thanks for doing all the hard work!

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Old 08-27-2009, 10:48 AM   #68
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I bought a candi thermometer which seems to work better than a regular thermometer for this. Also you should be heating on medium heat, to high of a heat and it'll scorch real quick. I did the 290F and wasn't pleased with the results, I made a variation of it that goes up to 310F for my westveletern 12. Here's my variation.

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:30 PM   #69
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It was on a very low heat and took about an hour and 10 minutes to make the #5 sugar. I am happy with how it turned out but wasn't sure what color it should be. My thermometer is a lab grade digital and I'm rather sure it's accurate at 290F but who knows. I can look for a candy thermometer at the Wally Mart. If it's under $8 or so maybe I'll get it.

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:36 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkpq45 View Post
Out of all the folks that have tried making this, what's the best beer recipe in which to use it? English brown? Belgian dubbel?

I made a batch of the 290*F syrup last night. I definitely taste plums, raisins, figs, etc. Color is a bit darker (like the 300*F) even though the flavors came out like your 290*F.
I made a Westvleteren clone with syrup using these techniques and at only 6 weeks old it is one of the best beers that I have ever made.
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