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Nateo · 01-24-2011, 11:35 PM

Ysgard, what temps did you hit at the peak of the ramps? I was thinking of trying four ramps on the next batch @ 290 > 280 > 270 > 260 to try to maximize Maillard reactions and minimize caramelization. I think that would get me closer to the dark chocolate flavors in D2 syrup, but I guess we'll see.

Tall_Yotie · 01-26-2011, 05:22 PM

I was reading through this thread, and there is a lot of info on how to make it, and even how it tastes.

What I am really wanting to know is if anyone has actually used this in their beer (specifically a Belgian), and if so did it give the same effects to the final product as the store-bought stuff (deep fruits, etc.)?

There is a wide-spread distributor issue with the Belgian Candi Syrup supplier, at least here in the US. I have some brews that I need it for, and was going to make it on my own, but I have yet to really see anyone report back after using it in their brew with how it tastes in the final product.

Anyone have any tasting notes for their brews?

jpoder · 01-26-2011, 06:20 PM

I tried doing a 4 stage sugar last night...actually 2, one with table sugar and one with Turbinado. it was interesting that the Turbinado took much longer to reach the target temp at each ramp.

basics were that i used 1 LB of sugar, 1 cup of water, and 1 1/2 tsp of DAP for each. temp targets were 290, 280, 270, 260. once they hit the target temp I added 1 cup of cool water (knocked the temp below 240 after stirring)

The end products were remarkably similar despite one sugar being less refined than the other. The color is dead on for D2 syrup (used motor oil black, with a brown/red slight foam on top) taste, however still seems a bit lacking. very sweet (almost a sour/tart taste), but no dark chocolate flavor.

Don't get me wrong, these are not bad (and I've used them in my beer (resulting pending...)), but they don't seem to be a D2 clone. I'd like to try changing ratio of glucose/fructose and trying again. any other ideas to try?

Nateo · 01-27-2011, 05:26 AM

Since this thread is really long and cumbersome to navigate, I've started my own thread with some of my variations:

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/candi-syrup-experiment-trying-clone-d2-220882/#post2588870

I think I'm onto something with the dextrose idea. I was able to get a lot of Maillard reactions without too much caramelization.

**smokinghole** · 02-10-2011, 11:49 PM

So I have a question. I have some jaggery in my house that is kitul jaggery which is palm sugar. This stuff is already dark, could there be any ill effects from cooking it like you guys are doing with white sugar?

twohands · 02-11-2011, 01:24 AM

It burns at a lower temp...go easy on the darker colors.

**KYB** · 02-11-2011, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpoder

I tried doing a 4 stage sugar last night...actually 2, one with table sugar and one with Turbinado. it was interesting that the Turbinado took much longer to reach the target temp at each ramp.

basics were that i used 1 LB of sugar, 1 cup of water, and 1 1/2 tsp of DAP for each. temp targets were 290, 280, 270, 260. once they hit the target temp I added 1 cup of cool water (knocked the temp below 240 after stirring)

The end products were remarkably similar despite one sugar being less refined than the other. The color is dead on for D2 syrup (used motor oil black, with a brown/red slight foam on top) taste, however still seems a bit lacking. very sweet (almost a sour/tart taste), but no dark chocolate flavor.

Don't get me wrong, these are not bad (and I've used them in my beer (resulting pending...)), but they don't seem to be a D2 clone. I'd like to try changing ratio of glucose/fructose and trying again. any other ideas to try?

Why the declining target temps? What if one were to do a multi-stage rest increasing, like 260 and cool, bring up to 270 and cool, bring up to 280 and cool, bring up to 290 and cool? I looked around, maybe I'm just missing something.

jpoder · 02-11-2011, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODaniel

Why the declining target temps? What if one were to do a multi-stage rest increasing, like 260 and cool, bring up to 270 and cool, bring up to 280 and cool, bring up to 290 and cool? I looked around, maybe I'm just missing something.

You are bringing it just below the smoke/burning point at each successive rise. I'm sure someone else can give the food science explanation, but in practice the burn point is lower. You are trig to maximize the maillard reactions at each stage so want to go as high as you can without burning the sugar.

JeffB · 02-12-2011, 04:25 AM

I just made some dark amber for the first time, I took it nice and slow and everything came out very nice. My candy thermometer is a POS though, its at least 20 low. I stopped mine when I got the color as posted way in the beginning of this thread. It tastes great, is very raisin like with no bitter or burnt flavor at all. I had very little crystals in the pot when I was done, I attribute this to really taking the temps up slow. It took about 1 hour 15 minutes. I did not bring it back to temp after the last water addition, I just let it go to room temp. Im making this http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f66/caramel-amber-ale-167880/ tomorrow as my first all grain and am very excited.

Ill report back.

Josh254 · 02-13-2011, 01:55 PM

I followed the instructions on this thread and made three batches of this syrup. The first I added to a dubbel that I made which, resulted in a moderately high final gravity (1.016). The second batch was very bitter which I think may be due to heating too quickly. The third batch tastes great, but when I did an experiment to see how fermentable it was, nothing happened. All of the batches of syrup that were made were the dark version (either brought up to 290* once or twice).

A good friend of mine has been experimenting with this recipe as well and his dark syrup did not ferment either. He made two sugar solutions, one of the dark syrup and one of sucrose. Both solutions had a starting gravity of 1.050. The sucrose fermented out almost completely where the dark syrup lost either 2 or 4 gravity points.

Any ideas? Thanks