Why not Bleach for Bottle Cleaning

Bassman · 02-11-2010, 12:07 PM

I know many people here use Oxyclean for cleaning bottles and label removal. But what is wrong with using bleach for cleaning, not sanitizing? You have to rinse anyway and from people say here oxyclean can leave a residue.

What am I missing here, other than hair?

**Edcculus** · 02-11-2010, 12:15 PM

OxyClean is a better CLEANER than bleach. Fermenters and bottles develop calcium oxalate (beerstone). There are also some other organic deposits. Oxygen based cleaners like Oxy and PBW are great at getting rid of this beerstone with no scrubbing. IMO, bleach is a out dated product. It smells bad, should be used in well ventilated area, doesn't store well, irritates skin, messes up your clothes etc.

You still can use bleach, but there are better options. The reason not to use bleach as a sanitizer is that chlorine residue can create chlorophenols.

goodgodilovebeer · 02-11-2010, 12:17 PM

I've used bleach for the cleaning part in the past with good results. I guess it depends on how dirty the bottles are. If they're from a recycling depot, I'd get some PBW and let 'em soak for a couple of hours. You just need to rinse really, really, really well with bleach.

**Bobby_M** · 02-11-2010, 12:18 PM

I don't think bleach is a very good cleaner. I don't know the chemistry involved though.

Cliff897 · 02-11-2010, 01:53 PM

bleach increases wetting ERGO it will facilitate cleaning very nicely since wetting is a major aspect of cleaning. Ya gotta get the crap wet to get it in suspension. It's that simple.

If your titration is low enough to increase wetting but not so high that you have "issues" with skin contact it's a great and inexpensive way to go. Add a bit of vinegar to the mix and you also get sanitation or sterilization depending on strength.

My skin reacts to a strong bleach solution by drying out and cracking later on. I can counter this by using vinegar on my hands to neutralize the bleach but I gotta do it soon after contact.

Chuck Talley (inventor and Chemist behind Star San), says that 5 gallons of water and one ounce each of bleach & vinegar is a stone cold killer sanitizer and is also no rinse~!! I should think you'd want a stronger solution strength to get the wetting needed to also be using it as a cleaning solution.

kidsmakeyoucrazy · 02-11-2010, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cliff897

bleach increases wetting ERGO it will facilitate cleaning very nicely since wetting is a major aspect of cleaning. Ya gotta get the crap wet to get it in suspension. It's that simple.

If your titration is low enough to increase wetting but not so high that you have "issues" with skin contact it's a great and inexpensive way to go. Add a bit of vinegar to the mix and you also get sanitation or sterilization depending on strength.

My skin reacts to a strong bleach solution by drying out and cracking later on. I can counter this by using vinegar on my hands to neutralize the bleach but I gotta do it soon after contact.

Chuck Talley (inventor and Chemist behind Star San), says that 5 gallons of water and one ounce each of bleach & vinegar is a stone cold killer sanitizer and is also no rinse~!! I should think you'd want a stronger solution strength to get the wetting needed to also be using it as a cleaning solution.

I heard the same podcast. He says that bleach (properly prepared) is an excellent sanitizer and is indeed no-risne at those concentrations. His biggest problem with bleach is that without the vinegar addition the ph isn't right to truly sanitize, and then there's the safety issue of someone combining bleach and vinegar before adding the water....that would be "bad". You should add the bleach, mix well, then add the vinegar and mix well again. He also mentioned that it's not very shelf stable.

Bassman · 02-11-2010, 05:30 PM

As far as sanitizing goes I use Star San. But I have never cleaned bottles with Ocyclean or PBW. But the reply that PBW and oxyclean are just better is enough of a reason for me to use it.

I also heard the Chuck Tally interview and while it was interesting about using bleach and vinegar in water I'll stick with Star San.

**kladue** · 02-11-2010, 05:38 PM

The main cleaning aspect of bleach is the sodium hydroxide it is made with, after the chlorine evaporates the sodium hydroxide dissolves the organic materials. It is manufactured by injecting gas chlorine into a cold 2-5% sodium hydroxide in water solution.

NAVET · 02-11-2010, 06:08 PM

Bleach works well. However, if you don't rinse it well, rinse again, and rinse one more time, it will destroy your beer. Ok, maybe destroy is harsh, but it will ruin the flavor.
Don't ask how I know........
If you use it in the dishwasher run it through a full cycle with bleach and then run it again with just plain water.

**Boar Beer** · 02-11-2010, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NAVET

Bleach works well. However, if you don't rinse it well, rinse again, and rinse one more time, it will destroy your beer. Ok, maybe destroy is harsh, but it will ruin the flavor.
Don't ask how I know........
If you use it in the dishwasher run it through a full cycle with bleach and then run it again with just plain water.

If you are using a dishwasher just run a sanitize cycle and call it good.

Clean with PBW by follow the directions and you can see it work. Its cheap when you think of what you have invested in a batch of brew.

All our bottles and fermentors get PBW, i would not fool around with bleach if you paid me.