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Old 11-30-2007, 04:44 AM   #1
Courage
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Default no-scent dish soap and boiling water

I have read alot obout proper cleaning products for our beer equipment but I have a question anyway, Im looking for a very detailed answer.

If I use no-scent dish soap and boiling water in my bath tub to sanitize all my equipment what measurement of soap should I use for every litre of water used?
Also, If I wash my hands with this no-scent dish soap will it be fine for me to handle the equipment after washed and dried?

Will my tub be a good place to wash? Or no.

Any input would be helpful.
Thank You.

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Old 11-30-2007, 01:31 PM   #2
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You have to be careful of semantics here.

Specifically, what is your working definition of "sanitize"?

Technically, when a garbage truck empties a full dumpster into the truck box the dumpster has been sanitized. When you sweep the floor of the garage and lift the oil soaked kitty litter into a trash can one correct name for what you did to the floor of the garage is sanitation.

The path of least resistance to good beer is to use a two step process. iam stillr eading up, but for now the easy way is to first clean your equipment and then second disinfect.

If there is any visible dirt anywhere, you aren't ready to disinfect yet.

I can assure you dish soap has zero anti-microbial activity, but certainly you -could- disinfect with boiling water.

It would be a more pleasant job for you to get everything mechanically clean - no visible dirt- with dish soap and just "hot" water. Then rinse with hot water. Then use boiling water to disinfect.

Not to discourage you, but I doubt you'll keep doing it that way without some gear more specialized than a bathtub.

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Old 11-30-2007, 01:37 PM   #3
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Soap (even antimicrobial soaps) do nothing to help on the sanitization front.

Buy yourself some Star-San or Iodophor. Both work very quickly (30 second - 2 minute contact time). No rinsing required - really. It takes longer than that for heat alone to sanitize. Both are pretty cheap in the grand scheme of things. Neither require you to lug all your gear to the bathtub and get however many gallons of boiling water up there, too. Both are very proven products that the majority of us use to great success.

Alternatively, study up on the use of bleach as a sanitizer; not as ideal (it's not no-rinse like the others), but it's cheap and effective.

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Old 11-30-2007, 01:44 PM   #4
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First of all: soap is not a sanitizer. It is a cleaner. Plain old soap and water, with good rinsing is all you need to clean things--- don't worry about the ratios just avoid scents or 'anti spotting agents' (and by 'avoid' I mean just that-- avoid it but there's no need to go all OCD about it).

That being said sanitation in brewing is one of the big boogeymen, especially in forums. At the end of the day when you look under the bed, the boogeyman isn't really there--- they just think he is. It is possible to use copious amounts of plain old water--- water that is safe for your kids to drink--- sluiced over clean gear to achieve an appropriate level of sanitation.

However, sanitiation and the chemicals to use is one of the big online debates that people have in brewing. People will often swear by their specific chemicals, processes and gear and it can easily blow up into arguments not unlike those abour religion.

And here's a place where I listed some of the stuff I've done to beer that came out fine.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showpost...6&postcount=24
I had a list somewhere on this forum of various things my father or I have done to beer and not had anything bad result. Among them are:

-Dog drinks from fermenter
-kid puts hands/toys in fermenter
-sneeze into fermenter

As much as homebrew communities obsess about 'sanitiation', beer is far more forgiving of these kinds of things than people give it credit for.

Consider this: once upon a time Germans didn't believe yeast was a component in beer. Instead they counted on their unsanitary wooden paddle, used to stir the wort, to infuse enough yeast into the mix to cause fermentation.

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Old 11-30-2007, 01:46 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poindexter
Technically, when a garbage truck empties a full dumpster into the truck box the dumpster has been sanitized. When you sweep the floor of the garage and lift the oil soaked kitty litter into a trash can one correct name for what you did to the floor of the garage is sanitation.
False.

Here are the definitions from the State of Wisconsin Health department, based on FDA guidelines.
Clean: free of visible soil including food particles and dirt
Sanitary: free of harmful levels of disease causing micro organisms and other harmful contaminates
Sterile: the absence of all living micro organsims

A recently dumped garbage truck would not be clean or santitary.
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Old 11-30-2007, 01:55 PM   #6
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Boiling hot water may warp or melt your plastic pieces. Pouring boiling water over a glass carboy will probably crack it. You also need longer contact times than just splashing in a bath tub will achieve.

Do yourself a favor and get some Star San today. If you've really read as much as you say you have then you should know this already.

Dish soap is fine for cleaning. Just clean well and rinse well in hot water.

As Kornkob points out, it is easy to go overboard with sanitation. Clean your brewery equipment like you would clean your dishes, dunk it in Star San for insurance, and call it done.

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Old 11-30-2007, 04:25 PM   #7
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I usually read brewing books, as you can see im new to this forum thing.
I simply wanted to know if the soap route was an ok one, and I see that it can be.

To the first post, im cleaning in my tub... Not brewing in it.

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Old 11-30-2007, 04:27 PM   #8
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Cleaning is ok wherever you do it- I think it was being pointed out that sanitizing is crucial, though!

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Old 11-30-2007, 04:32 PM   #9
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I dont see why hot/semi-boiling water wouldnt work for sanitization.
It kills off all the extra soap and whatever smell there is left, Isnt that what we want in sanitization so we dont ruin our next batch of beer?

I dont mean boiling to the point of destroying items.

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Old 11-30-2007, 04:34 PM   #10
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... and that boiling water is, best case, mighty inconvenient, worst case, will destroy your plastic goods and potentially shatter your carboy (they are very sensitive to thermal shock). I'm also not convinced that the short period of time you would be exposing your stuff to the boiling water would be sufficient to kill everything. Remember, when you boil drinking water, you boil it for 5-10 minutes.

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