I Hate Vorlaufing

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Amiaji

Amiaji

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I hate vorlaufing. I dont like draining out wort and pouring it back in the MLT. It is my main gripe about going AG. So I have been thinking of a way to avoid it.

Is there any reason why attaching a nylon paint strainer bag to the output of the MLT wouldnt work? It should have a fine enough mesh to catch anything that came out of the MLT. All I would have to do then is open the drain slowly to set the grainbed then drain away. Add my sparge water and repeat. After the sparge is done just remove the nylon bag and all the grain should go with it.

Am I missing something or do you guys think it would work?
 
it wont catch proteins but it might get bits of grain, so it would help but not eliminate the need for a vorlauf. I dont understand why you would hate it, how much do you have to vorlauf to get clear runnings? if its more than a gallon you might want to play with your manifold/false bottom/braid to make life easier.
 
Its usually only 2qts or so but for some reason it really bothers me. I just figured if all we really need to do is keep husks out of the boil then why wouldnt a paint strainer work.
 
Compared to clean-up and washing? It takes less than 30 seconds for me to vorlauf my wort.

Cleaning up and washing the stuff is FAR more of a PITA.
 
It never occurred to me to hate vorlaufing. Actually, I think I kind of like it.

Cleanup is even kind of quick and easy for me somehow. The only thing I've ever really HATED is bottling.
 
BerserkerBrew said:
Vorlaufing could be my favorite part of brewing.... if only because the word "vorlauf" is just so awesome!
Click to expand...

My buddies (non brewers) like using brewing terms in their own way - they think its hilarious for some reason. For example, after hearing the word "vorlauf", they now use it in placement of "vomit". As in, "Dude, I was so hammered last night I vorlaufed all over my shoes.

On a related note, I hate vorlaufing only because I always forget to when I go to drain my mash tun. I'm an AG noob so hopefully I'll start remembering before I open the ball valve.
 
When you vorlauf (recirculate) you are setting the grain bed so it acts like a filter. If you don't do this long enough then the grain bed will still pass some solids. A pump is a great way to do this but in the past I have just used 2 stainless pans and while one is filling up I am pouring the other back in the tun until it runs clear. It's really quite easy and I do not understand why you hate it?
 
BrewBrain said:
It never occurred to me to hate vorlaufing. Actually, I think I kind of like it.

Cleanup is even kind of quick and easy for me somehow. The only thing I've ever really HATED is bottling.
Click to expand...

and yet bottling is probably my favorite part -each bottle lovingly capped, to condition, full of the promise of beers to consume. I like kegging for a different reason -love draft beer.

Kind if interesting how we each look at the process differently.
 
There's a school of thought that says that the vorlauf step isn't even needed. If you don't like it, don't do it. Just like the rest of the floaties, the little bit of grain will settle out.
 
WBC said:
in the past I have just used 2 stainless pans and while one is filling up I am pouring the other back in the tun until it runs clear. It's really quite easy and I do not understand why you hate it?
Click to expand...


That's a great idea. I noticed every time I open and closed the valve, it disturbs the grainbed just enough to let a little bit of grain pass. Thanks for the tip, I love this forum.
 
"Vorlauf" is kind of a misnomer. It doesn't refer to the recirculation process itself; rather what you're recirculating.

A few weeks ago I was talking with a few brewing friends, one of which lived in Germany for 5 years, was a German homebrewer-, and is of course fluent in German. We started talking about all-grain and of course "vorlauf" came up and according to him and some of the German brewing literature he showed me (my German is very basic but I got through it), it would seem "vorlauf" refers to "initial runnings", not "recirculation". After discussing this here, I sent him an email and asked him to reiterate ('cause I was still confused on the meaning myself):

Vorlauf, in the German sense, is definitely the first runnings;
more precisely, we should call it the intial runnings, since to
say first runnings might imply even more liquid, possibly enough
liquid to do a full batch, with second runnings providing enough
for a second batch. Vorlauf is only the first bit (gallon or so?)
that you recirculate.

Anyway, not only is (to me) the meaning apparent from the
word itself, but a quick look at the German brewing literature
(as well as German distilling literature) indicates that.

And it just happens that the Vorlauf (initial runnings) are indeed
recirculated in brewing. In distillation, they are often discarded.
So technically, Vorlauf doesn't imply recirculation.

Anyway, do not confuse Vorlauf with a full recirculating sparge.
Click to expand...
All that time I was using it wrong. :eek:
 
sigmund said:
There's a school of thought that says that the vorlauf step isn't even needed. If you don't like it, don't do it. Just like the rest of the floaties, the little bit of grain will settle out.
Click to expand...


This is perhaps what I have been hoping to hear. With the braid in my cooler, the runnings don't really change that much. The initial runnings I return to the tun are not all that different, maybe the first couple ounces are a bit cloudy, but really, will this amount do anything harmful?. I usually recirc a couple of quarts just because it is "what you are supposed to do"

Not really sure it's doing much for me? Anyone else w/ a braid
feel this way?

Mike
 
This is perhaps what I have been hoping to hear. With the braid in my cooler, the runnings don't really change that much. The initial runnings I return to the tun are not all that different, maybe the first couple ounces are a bit cloudy, but really, will this amount do anything harmful?. I usually recirc a couple of quarts just because it is "what you are supposed to do"

Not really sure it's doing much for me? Anyone else w/ a braid
feel this way?
Click to expand...

I use a braid with my MLT and the wort runs substantially clearer after recirculating approx 2 qts, and without the extra particulate that would wind up in my kettle if I didn't do this. By getting the smaller bits back on top of the bed where they belong, the filtration that the grain bed provides is much more efficient.
 
I still dont see how pouring a bit of wort back into a cooler in that much of a hassle but if you hate it so much dont bother.
 
Go ahead skip the Vorlauf I dare ya...The Vorlauf Gods will find you and punish you with crappy beer. ;)
 
When I'm batch sparging, vorlaufing takes literally ninety seconds, tops. I end up draining a few quarts, but it doesn't take very long at all. OP, are you batch sparging or fly? How long are you taking to vorlauf? How quickly are you draining? It also may well be that you're trying to vorlauf too long, you don't need the wort to be crystal clear (it won't be), you really just need to get the grain particiles set into a filter bed. The wort will still be running cloudy, but that's fine.
 
My original intention was to see if using a grain bag would eliminate the need to vorlauf. I didnt expect the title to get people so aroused. It doesnt take that long its just one of the things I see as a waste of time. I batch sparge and usually fill up a 2qt measuring cup once or twice then start draining into the BK. I just figured if a grainbag would catch the bits that get through then that would be just as good as vorlaufing.
 
Other vorlauf questions. It does take some time for me. I use a pump and direct fire the mlt to get up to sparge temp. It takes 15 minutes to get the temp up and get clean runnings. Should I increase the flow of the recircing to get the bed to set sooner? I use low heat because I don't want to scorch or cause it to boil under the FB and unseat the mash. My last brew looked like a finished beer when I took the OG. But this method added 15-20 minutes to the brew. I also noticed the last time at the LHBS that the mill bearings were worn and the gap had opened, would more flour contribute to shorter vorlaufs?
 
beerthirty said:
I also noticed the last time at the LHBS that the mill bearings were worn and the gap had opened, would more flour contribute to shorter vorlaufs?
Click to expand...

Did you mention this to them?

Usually those bearings are sleeves and can be pressed out and pressed in. This goes to show that they have not looked at it for a very long time. I also bet the rollers knurl is not very sharp any more and need to be re-knurled or replaced. This is one of the costs of doing business.
 
Of course, but as you know the answer is "whats a lb of grain to get your projected OG?" My answer is more money every time I brew. Their answer is more profit anytime someone brews. Back to my question, I seem to recall a ratio between crushed grain(particles) and flour. The mechanic in me tells me that a filter that is 20-30% plugged is more efficient than a clean filter because it catches more of the fine particles(flour) that would pass through a clean filter, so more flour would make for a better filter as it would partially plug the bed creating better filtering.
My grain cart is almost finished but until then I am stuck with their mill and crush. How much flour should I be looking for in my grain?
 
Somewhat related question.

I do BIAB, so "vorlaufing" for me consisted of me:

1) placing the grain bag (within the steaming basket) on top of an oven rack that's on top of the kettle.

2) opening the valve to fill a 2 quart pitcher, close the valve, dump wort on top of grains, repeat.


I haven't noticed anything different when I vorlaufed, so is it the process in how I'm doing it, the BIAB way of brewing, something else, or all of the above? Is a pump recommended or a waste of money for my setup?

I didn't bother vorlaufing on the last batch either. It was a stout, so I figured it wouldn't matter as much on a dark beer like a stout.


EDIT: Holy crap, didn't realize how old this thread was....Oh well.
 

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